Points in the Paint - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

kg_veteran · 11-14-2003, 05:58 PM

Bayliss mentioned to me this morning how totally opposite this team was from last year's group offensively, at least thus far. So I did a little quick research...

So far, in 9 games, the Mavericks have outscored their opponents in the paint by 96 points, or an average of nearly 11 points per game. Also, they have been outscored in the paint only once, on opening night against the Lakers. If you take that game out, they're outscoring opponents by over 13 ppg in the paint.

The team is learning to score from the inside out.

Murphy3 · 11-14-2003, 06:06 PM

Thanks for the research. I would expect the Mavs to increase both their points in the paint and their points outside the paint as the season continues. Surely the Mavs will begin to pound the ball more and more into dirk, jamison and Walker as the season progresses. It's the only logical thing to do.

As the Mavs do more of this, it'll mean more open looks for outside shooters. And yes, the Mavs will start hitting more of their open threes at some point.

What does that mean? The Mavs will just be an even more deadly team offensively.

I'm not sure what everyone's 2pt percentage is, but I did see that Dirk is shooting almost 60% from within the three point arc. No, not all of these attempts are in the paint, but you can see how deadly Dirk is when he gets more touches closer to the basket.

As for Walker, his biggest asset in the paint is his ability to distribute the ball. I'll always believe that the more you keep Walker away from the 3 pointer the better it'll be for him and the Mavs. Yes, I know he hasn't shot poorly from the outside just yet. But, when the Mavs make an effort to get the ball down low, they're dominant offensively.

As for Jamison, I'm really still learning about his abilities in the post. I knew that he was a good low post scorer, but he's shown a hook shot a few times that I don't remember seeing in the past. Plus, the guy is athletic enough to crash the boards and provide easy put backs. Jamison is a very nice player with his back to the basket. The Mavs now have three PF's that can effectively play down on the low blocks. I'm gonna like this.

LRB · 11-14-2003, 06:13 PM

Thanks for the research KG. I was wondering how many of the games we'd won the scoring battle in the paint. This is indeed a much different team that last years. It kills me that there are valid stats out there like this and the increase in our overall rebounding (especially on the offensive end) and yet the talking @$$es on TNT keep talking about the Mavs as if we're the same team as last years. You think they would at least do as much as some fans on a message board. Or maybe they should just do like Fish and read our board. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

kg_veteran · 11-14-2003, 06:14 PM

Two point percentages for the forwards:

Nowitzki 58.9
Walker 55.7
Jamison 48

All of them are very efficient inside the arc.

Also, the team shoots 48.5% inside the arc overall.

Once the threes start dropping, look out.

LRB · 11-14-2003, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Once the threes start dropping, look out.

And/or Dirk masters that hook shot.

Murphy3 · 11-14-2003, 06:17 PM

Thanks for the stats KG. You add Dirk's ability to get to the line when he gets the ball down low, and he quickly becomes a big time threat in the paint.

kg_veteran · 11-14-2003, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: LRB
Thanks for the research KG. I was wondering how many of the games we'd won the scoring battle in the paint.

Here are the game-by-game numbers:

Dallas Opponent

10-28-03: LAL 34 44
10-29-03: GS 52 46
11-1-03: Utah 58 38
11-3-03: Miami 34 28
11-5-03: Wash. 46 30
11-6-03: Toronto 38 28
11-8-03: SAS 48 30
11-11-03: NO 64 38
11-13-03: Houston 40 36

kg_veteran · 11-14-2003, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: kg_veteran

Also, the team shoots 48.5% inside the arc overall.

By way of comparison, the Mavs as a team shot 47.5% inside the arc last year.

kingrex · 11-14-2003, 06:25 PM

This is an excellent trend, worth tracking througout the year. As Murphy pointed out, it only adds another dimension to our game. I also like that we've been heading to the line because of our inside offense. Points in the paint and getting to the line are crucial in the Playoffs, and I'm glad we're developing that part of our game more.

Simon2 · 11-14-2003, 07:35 PM

Did the Mavs outscore the Lakers in the paint in the first game? I am just curious.

LRB · 11-14-2003, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Simon2
Did the Mavs outscore the Lakers in the paint in the first game? I am just curious.

No. See KG's post. Lakeshow outscored us 44 to our 34 in the paint.

Max Power · 11-14-2003, 08:07 PM

I'm soooo glad that our 3's AREN'T falling for us right now. If they were then there is a strong possibility that we would be relying on them as a primary weapon again (like we did last year). THIS year, because the 3's aren't falling forces us to be a good team at scoring inside. Strong playoff teams can score inside at will. We are becoming a team that should be a force in the playoffs.

Dirk Nowitzki · 11-14-2003, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3
Thanks for the stats KG. You add Dirk's ability to get to the line when he gets the ball down low, and he quickly becomes a big time threat in the paint.

It seems as if Dirk is getting a few calls in the post that where not going his way last year. Could this be the beggining of "star treatment" for Dirk?

jayC · 11-14-2003, 10:12 PM

Those inside paint percentages for Dirk are unbelievable. I think it shows that Dirk just needs to stay in the paint. Too many times it seems he is out of the game by just staying on the perimeter.

I think the biggest suprise is the variety and success of post moves that Walker has, and the unbelievably fast shot that Jamison has.

kg_veteran · 11-15-2003, 01:16 PM

Just to clarify so that the stats aren't "misapplied", the percentages are "inside the arc" or two-point shot percentages, not percentages in the paint. Dirk takes a ton of 18 footers. I'm not saying that he's not effective on the block; I'm simply saying I don't have a breakdown as between the two, but I'd be willing to wager that Dirk scores more of his points inside the arc from mid-range than he does in the paint.

Bayliss · 11-15-2003, 01:39 PM

Dirk's favorite play... or at least Nellie's favorite play is having someone sets a screen for Dirk and he usually fades to the elbow... or wing... and shoots a 15 footer.

Rarely this year has Dirk been posted up... but he is scoring a lot in the midrange and a lot in the paint off the cuts. Walker has set him more this year for layups/dunks than I can recall him having all of last year. (That is a big reason why his fg% is better this year... he's getting easier shots.)

The media will pick up to the fact that we are no longer a jumpshooting team. But it is going to take them at least a year or two.

LRB · 11-15-2003, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Bayliss

The media will pick up to the fact that we are no longer a jumpshooting team. But it is going to take them at least a year or two.

Bayliss I think you give the media far too much credit. These are the same people who use scouting from Michael Finely's rookie season to describe his current game. They are lazy, inept, and as a general rule dumber than a rock. Until something is tatooed in ink on their forehead, they are highly unlikely to get it and sometimes not even then. But feed them a false rumor and they are all over it even with the most cursitory research would have proven it to be false.

ames7 · 11-15-2003, 02:23 PM

It kills me that the 3s aren't dropping & they still took 19 against Houston. I noticed that out of halftime, they came out & started stepping forward just a step or two to take the shot instead & it went in. But as the half went on, they went back to shooting, & missing, the 3 shot. It's in their nature, I guess.

Anyway, I really do like the extra dimensions to the team & I think they don't get enough credit for adding them essentially w/out loosing anything they had before. They are as good or potentially better at everything they did last year, plus they can rebound & score in the paint. I don't see how anyone can say this team isn't at least potentially better than last year's. TNT can shove it.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

kg_veteran · 11-17-2003, 11:21 AM

Updating the numbers...

Dallas Opponent

10-28-03: LAL 34 44
10-29-03: GS 52 46
11-1-03: Utah 58 38
11-3-03: Miami 34 28
11-5-03: Wash. 46 30
11-6-03: Toronto 38 28
11-8-03: SAS 48 30
11-11-03: NO 64 38
11-13-03: Houston 40 36
11-15-03: Memphis 40 54

Tough to beat anybody when you allow them to score half of their points in the paint.

sike · 11-17-2003, 11:29 AM

one thing: yea Dirk is getting some nice shots from about 12-18, but why not more of them??? Can anyone tell me how may shot attempts he is getting this year?...it seems like a lost less than last year, is he getting less, or am I just a Dirk fan wanting him to take it every time down the court...quite possibly both![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

Murphy3 · 11-17-2003, 11:37 AM

Dirk's taking 15.4 attempts per game..last year he was up to 18.6.

He's hitting almost 60% of his attempts from within the three point arc.

sike · 11-17-2003, 11:46 AM

to take that step to superstardom, he will need between 18-22 shots a game....where can he get the extra 3-5 a game? can he find them, or are they lost to Walker and Jamison and we will not see the progression we thought we would this season....

dude1394 · 11-17-2003, 12:55 PM

Dirk would probably get more touches if he didn't turn it over so much or pass it better. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

sike · 11-17-2003, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: dude1394
Dirk would probably get more touches if he didn't turn it over so much or pass it better. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

Shaq: 3.10 TOs a game, Duncan 3.75 TOs a game....

not such a good point dude!

Murphy3 · 11-17-2003, 01:18 PM

Dude's obviously joking....turning the ball over too much in a 10 game stretch of one season hardly offsets the great job that Dirk has done protecting the ball over the past 3-4 years.

dude1394 · 11-17-2003, 01:29 PM

I'm wondering if my icon is making me look to mean. No matter how many smilie faces I put on posts they are perceived as nasty. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

kingrex · 11-17-2003, 01:47 PM

I do want to see more plays called with Dirk on the block. He needs to develop that for the playoffs and what better time than during the reg season. We know he can score off elbow, so why not open up another aspect of his offensive arsenal. I want Dirk to gain McHale-like skills downlow.

I want to see Jamison mix in more dunks in favor of the floater. I realize he's got a nice floater, but many times when he misses a shot under the basket, I wish he would have just dunked it.

I want to see more Walker high-low combinations with Dirk, Jamison or Finley. I prefer that than Walker passing from the backcourt like a point guard would. I prefer him passing with his back to the basket with dive cutter or back cutters coming in at angles to the basket.

Finally, I want to see more tip-ins from all our front court players. Walker and Jamison are doing a great job with this, but I want to see more.

All these points in the paint will only make our 3 point shooting even more of a weapon.