How do you guys feel about JHo/Stack for T-Mac trade?

[dalmations202]

Originally Posted by ty

I disagree that he has more potential than LBJ. Lebron is a freak of nature, and he's only 24 years old.

I also disagree that he has more talent than Kobe. Kobe is arguably one of the most talented players to ever play the game.

Best Statistical Season scoring for each of them.... Tell me which one is TMac and which one is LBJ and which one is Kobe.

1)79 42.6 48.0 73.8 33.5 7.0 6.6 1.6 0.8 31.4
2)75 39.4 45.7 79.3 38.6 6.5 5.5 1.6 0.8 32.1
3)80 40.9 45.0 85.0 34.8 5.3 4.5 1.8 0.4 35.4

Gms, min, fg%, ft%, 3pt%, Rbs, Asst, stl, blk, ppg

I do not deny that TMac doesn't play with as much passion anymore, but his talent and ability were undeniable, IMO. He also never has had the competitive fire of a Jordan or Kobe. He has always had that ability though.

[ty]

Originally Posted by dalmations202

Best Statistical Season scoring for each of them.... Tell me which one is TMac and which one is LBJ and which one is Kobe.

1)79 42.6 48.0 73.8 33.5 7.0 6.6 1.6 0.8 31.4
2)75 39.4 45.7 79.3 38.6 6.5 5.5 1.6 0.8 32.1
3)80 40.9 45.0 85.0 34.8 5.3 4.5 1.8 0.4 35.4

Gms, min, fg%, ft%, 3pt%, Rbs, Asst, stl, blk, ppg

I do not deny that TMac doesn't play with as much passion anymore, but his talent and ability were undeniable, IMO. He also never has had the competitive fire of a Jordan or Kobe. He has always had that ability though.

Gms, min, fg%, ft%, 3pt%, Rbs, Asst, stl, blk, ppg

Lebron '05-'06
1)79 42.6 48.0 73.8 33.5 7.0 6.6 1.6 0.8 31.4

T-Mac '02-'03
2)75 39.4 45.7 79.3 38.6 6.5 5.5 1.6 0.8 32.1

Kobe '05-'06
3)80 40.9 45.0 85.0 34.8 5.3 4.5 1.8 0.4 35.4

...but IMO, one could argue that Kobe's '02-'03 season was better (unless you're basing it totally off of PPG)

Kobe '02-'03
82 41.5 45.1 84.3 38.3 6.9 5.9 2.2 0.8 30.0

I'm trying to understand what you're saying...that T-Mac had the potential and talent mix but it's gone?

Even with those season numbers, I can't give him the runaway for potential/talent, especially since the season that you believe is his best occurs 3 years before Kobe's/Lebron's. Also, IMO I just don't believe that those numbers alone give me enough evidence that he's more talented or has more potential than Kobe or Lebron.

My thoughts on talent:
For what it's worth, it really isn't a hard stat, but just through watching the things they do on the court. I have to give talent to Kobe, based on his arsenal of offensive talent. The man makes the most unbelievable shots. Floaters, fades, pull-ups, post-moves, with or without the glass, layups, reverses...the list is really endless. I'm not sure if there has been any other player that has had such a wide range of offensive skills.

My thoughts on potential:
Lebron is only in his 6th year, and he's on pace to break A LOT of records. That combined with the fact that TMac is in his 12th year, doesn't really win T-Mac's "potential case" for me. It just seems to me like Lebron has a lot more room to grow, and many more things to learn...like how not to travel

Anyways, just my personal thoughts. Don't mean any harm by them. Also, trying to understand a bit more about what you're saying...

[dalmations202]

Originally Posted by ty

Gms, min, fg%, ft%, 3pt%, Rbs, Asst, stl, blk, ppg

Lebron '05-'06
1)79 42.6 48.0 73.8 33.5 7.0 6.6 1.6 0.8 31.4

T-Mac '02-'03
2)75 39.4 45.7 79.3 38.6 6.5 5.5 1.6 0.8 32.1

Kobe '05-'06
3)80 40.9 45.0 85.0 34.8 5.3 4.5 1.8 0.4 35.4

...but IMO, one could argue that Kobe's '02-'03 season was better (unless you're basing it totally off of PPG)

Kobe '02-'03
82 41.5 45.1 84.3 38.3 6.9 5.9 2.2 0.8 30.0

I'm trying to understand what you're saying...that T-Mac had the potential and talent mix but it's gone?

Even with those season numbers, I can't give him the runaway for potential/talent, especially since the season that you believe is his best occurs 3 years before Kobe's/Lebron's. Also, IMO I just don't believe that those numbers alone give me enough evidence that he's more talented or has more potential than Kobe or Lebron.

My thoughts on talent:
For what it's worth, it really isn't a hard stat, but just through watching the things they do on the court. I have to give talent to Kobe, based on his arsenal of offensive talent. The man makes the most unbelievable shots. Floaters, fades, pull-ups, post-moves, with or without the glass, layups, reverses...the list is really endless. I'm not sure if there has been any other player that has had such a wide range of offensive skills.

My thoughts on potential:
Lebron is only in his 6th year, and he's on pace to break A LOT of records. That combined with the fact that TMac is in his 12th year, doesn't really win T-Mac's "potential case" for me. It just seems to me like Lebron has a lot more room to grow, and many more things to learn...like how not to travel

Anyways, just my personal thoughts. Don't mean any harm by them. Also, trying to understand a bit more about what you're saying...

Very nice reply ... with some actual thought to it. Thank You.


I guess I have been watching so many years now that I forget how long people have been doing some of the things they have been doing. You are correct in all you wrote, and I agree (sort of).

When I stated more talent/potential than Kobe and LBJ -- was was talking about a few years ago before the injuries, age, etc. I have not seen anyone who looked as smooth and fluid (making it look easy) as TMac since Dr. J was playing. TMac seemed to me, to be a player who was a slasher and a shooter all balled up into one. He could drive, he could come off screens, he had the mid range, the finish, and a pretty good three point shot. He is 6'8" tall and not down in the 6'4"-6'6" range that is SG sized. He had a much cleaner shot, and was a much better overall shooter than LBJ.

As of now, Kobe is the best in the league, with LBJ biting at his heels, IMO.

TMac didn't have the one thing both of these two have: the attitude and killer instinct. Kobe knows he can beat you, and does it because beating you is fun to him. Knowing there is nothing you can do about it is fun to him. You see it in his eyes -- just like you did Jordans. They are having their most fun when it is all on the line, and they are destroying you. TMac, IMO, has more ability, but he isn't wired that way. He enjoys the game -- sometimes, -- but he doesn't seem to enjoy just destroying others. The games seem to wear on TMac, and he seems like he plays it because it is his job -- not because of competition or drive. This is why he will never hoist the trophy, IMO, where he is at in Houston. Yao can't be that drive -- it isn't in him either.

Few players do have that -- and that is what makes them extremely special.

I guess I am saying that if TMac had the WILLPOWER to change the outcome of games and not allow defeat like Kobe, and LBJ is learning that I think he would have been considered the better player, in the history of the game. Since he doesn't -- it is meaning less.

[sefant77]

Step away from your crackdealer.

McLady is a weak always injuried crybaby jumpshooter, nothing more these days. This guy is done, mentally and physical.

He dont play any D anymore, chucking like Crawford and is crying about too less touches. How you want him to work with Dirk and Terry? If he play...

No thanks.

[Re-Dirk-ulous]

They were discussing trade scenarios on NBA TV's "The Beat" and that Mark guy mentioned J-Ho for T-Mac.

If only T-Mac is motivated enough to still do stuff like THIS (but in the playoffs goddamit!), it wouldn't be that bad of a deal for the Mavs.

[Sportstudi]

Originally Posted by Re-Dirk-ulous

They were discussing trade scenarios on NBA TV's "The Beat" and that Mark guy mentioned J-Ho for T-Mac.

If only T-Mac is motivated enough to still do stuff like THIS (but in the playoffs goddamit!), it wouldn't be that bad of a deal for the Mavs.

Well, his motivation... taking this into consideration in addition with his injury plagued body... That makes it really difficult for me to imagine to go after a trade. If he can play again like during his tenure with Orlando, I would do it in a heartbeat. But right now? No, thanks

[mac222b]

Originally Posted by sefant77

Step away from your crackdealer.

McLady is a weak always injuried crybaby jumpshooter, nothing more these days. This guy is done, mentally and physical.

He dont play any D anymore, chucking like Crawford and is crying about too less touches. How you want him to work with Dirk and Terry? If he play...

No thanks.

Word