Tracking the Bills (Dallas draft pick)

[Just211]

I know it's early (real early), but I thought I'd start this to keep track of how high Dallas will pick. Just for shit & giggles[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

<u>after week 2</u>
7 teams tied at 2-0
18 teams tied at 1-1
and
Kansas City
Houston
Miami
San Fran
Arizona
Tampa Bay
and BUFFALO at 0-2

which means right now it would be a top 7 pick.

SO FAR SO GOOD [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

keep it up Bills

[Male30Dan]

It should have been 20 teams tied at 1-1 with that Jacksonville miracle, but thank you Mr. Leftwich!!!

[capitalcity]

I know who i want already.

Antrel Rolle DB 6-1 200 lbs.

hes a stud

he's big time.

[Dooby]

Talk about parity. After two weeks we have seven teams with two wins and seven teams with two losses and eighteen teams with one win and one loss.

[alby]

how high do ya'll think cedric benson will be drafted? just curious..

[alby]

just saw this on dmn.com



AUSTIN – Texas running back Cedric Benson told ESPN Radio's "GameNight" he would rather win the Heisman Trophy than beat Oklahoma.

"If I could win the game entirely by myself – both offense and defense, punt returns, kickoffs, kicking field goals, do everything – then I'd take the win over OU," Benson said. "But for me personally, the hard work I've been through, growing up as a kid and the dream I've had, I'd love nothing more than to win the Heisman."

Cedric Benson has rushed for 379 yards in two games this season. Tell us: What do you think of Benson's comments? Texas coach Mack Brown defended Benson.

"Cedric wants to win or he wouldn't have come back" for his senior year, Brown said. "He could've been drafted by the NFL. Sometimes he gets excited and says things that don't come out the same way in the media as he wants them."

Benson, who is 0-3 against the Sooners, declined to respond to questions about the interview after practice Tuesday.



wtf ced

[mavs413]

I think the Cowboys' needs at the end of this year will be at the OL, DT, S, CB positions.
OL -
Jammal Brown, T - Oklahoma
Vince Carter, C - Oklahoma
David Baas, G - Michigan
DT -
Anttaj Hawthorne - Wisconsin
Rodrique Wright - Texas (jr)
Orien Harris - Miami (jr)
S -
Jamaal Brimmer, SS - UNLV
Josh Bullocks, FS - Nebraska
Donte Nicholson, SS - Oklahoma
CB -
Antrel Rolle, Miami
Corey Webster, LSU

But sometimes you just have to take the best available player:
Matt Leinart, QB - USC (jr)
Carnell Williams, RB - Auburn
Derrick Johnson, LB - Texas
Braylon Edwards, WR - Michigan
David Pollack, DE - Georgia
Andrew Walter, QB - Arizona State
Marcus Spears, DE - LSU
A.J. Hawk, LB - Ohio State
Mike Williams, WR - USC

[dirno2000]

I think the Cowboys' needs at the end of this year will be at the OL, DT, S, CB positions.

Agreed on all the above, but in my mind, our #1 need is a pass rush defensive end…somebody teams have to game plan for. This player immediately makes our secondary better.

[Murphy3]

OL is always a need for virtually every team. I'd love to see the Cowboys address the DT and CB needs in the first round if at all possible....I'd also like to also see the 'boys bring in another receiver eventually..but, I'm not sure next year's class will be deep enough to address that need.

Hopefully the 'boys will still have some cap space and will be able to address some of the needs in free agency instead of piddly farting around like last year.

[dirno2000]

Actually, we should be set on the O-line. Flozell is in his prime age wise and if LA keeps himself in shape, he can be effective for at least two or three more years. We've addressed the rest of the line by taking three linemen on the 1st day of the past two drafts. Torrin Tucker and Gerrard are coming around and Walter, Lehr and Vollers provide good dept. I wouldn't use a 1st day pick on an O-lineman.

Antrelle Rolle has impressed me more than any player I've seen this season, but can we afford to spend that kind of money on two corners? Before spending any more money on the secondary, the D-line has to be addressed.

I'm biased, but it would be interesting to see what Derrick Johnson could do as a 3-4 rush linebacker.

Don’t know what the cap will be, but we should have cap room again since we were conservative this year. I’m also betting that Cokely takes a pay cut or gets cut to clear some more room.

[Murphy3]

Sure, OL isn't a top need..but, it's not a bad idea to draft an offensive lineman at some point in every draft.

Unfortunately, the 'boys probably won't find much out about JJones this year. That could force Big Bill to bring in another RB either via the draft or via free agency....

[Fah Q]

my preference is Derrick Johnson

That guy is just amazing

[alby]

i say rolle or derrick johnson to replace dexter.. but we have to see how well pete hunter and co. will pan out during the rest of the season

[Fah Q]

Originally posted by: alby
i say rolle or derrick johnson to replace dexter.. but we have to see how well pete hunter and co. will pan out during the rest of the season

Actually I think Brady James is well on his way to replace Dexter. But I wouldn't mind the Cowboys shifting Brady to the Middle eventually and having DJ as the weakside LB.

I know we need corners and Rolle is a legit player but a guy like DJ comes along every so often.

BTW- Sorry if the UT homer is coming out in me. Shit I wouldn't mind seeing what what Rod Babers has in him. He's a free agent. And I was pissed when the cowboys passed up BJ Johnson, Sloan Thomas, and Nathan Vasher in the later rounds. I think one of them could've been a diamond in the rough just like Priest was. Thomas and Johnson would've been legit #1 WR's for many Schools if they hadn't been stuck behind Williams.

Sorry for getting off topic

[capitalcity]

Originally posted by: Fah Q

Actually I think Brady James is well on his way to replace Dexter. But I wouldn't mind the Cowboys shifting Brady to the Middle eventually and having DJ as the weakside LB.

I know we need corners and Rolle is a legit player but a guy like DJ comes along every so often.

BTW- Sorry if the UT homer is coming out in me. Shit I wouldn't mind seeing what what Rod Babers has in him. He's a free agent. And I was pissed when the cowboys passed up BJ Johnson, Sloan Thomas, and Nathan Vasher in the later rounds. I think one of them could've been a diamond in the rough just like Priest was. Thomas and Johnson would've been legit #1 WR's for many Schools if they hadn't been stuck behind Williams.

Sorry for getting off topic

Don't get me wrong - i love DJ too, but i think you have to look for Rolle first then DJ as a close second choice. We got Bradie James in the second round and he looks like the heir apparent to Coakley - based on this rationale i think you can get quality LBs easier than BIG Body/ shutdown CBs.

If he has his pick i don't know if Parcells passes on the LB hes always talking about - so maybe this time next year we are talking about DJ and BJ playing side by side.

BTW - I remember thinking BJ Johnson was better than Roy Williams when they both came in. However it soon became clear that BJ's role (at least in Greg Davis' offense) was to stretch the defensive secondary. When the running game got going he did turn in several deep ball touchdowns - but when it came down to it BJ couldn't be count on to make the tough catch. With the defensive focus on Roy he should have produced much more than he did.

When i think of Sloan Thomas i think of big catches - when i think of BJ Johnson i think of big drops.

[Fah Q]

Originally posted by: capitalcity

When i think of Sloan Thomas i think of big catches - when i think of BJ Johnson i think of big drops.

Amen on that. Sloan was a very underrated player. He was pretty damned clutch.

Back to the topic though. I'm guessing your a UT fan or atleast watch the games, so I'll ask you this question. Have you ever seen a LB as fast and as physical with as much instinct as Johnson in a long time? I wouldn't even say that Ray Lewis was as good as DJ when he was with MIami. Don't get me wrong, Lewis sure has progressed since he entered the NFL and I'm not comparing him to DJ because Lewis is by far better than him now and probably will always be, but DJ is by far the best player I've watched in college in quite a while, and I'm a big believer in picking the best available player.

[mavs413]

LaVar Arrington, Brian Urlacher, & Peter Boulware were all great LBs in college and are all-pro currently.
Johnson has to be considered as the top LB in this draft, however, I dont think he will have close to the success in the NFL as they have had or like Terrell Suggs had last year. Derrick looks a little small(thin) and has trouble shedding blocks, so IMO, he cannot play strong side linebacker. He will not be able to just run around blockers in the NFL like he is currently doing now. His pass coverage will also need to improve.
Right now, I say he is a 10-13 pick in the 1st round. His college game is similar to what Chris Claiborne's was at USC, who was picked in the top 10 and hasnt done much in the Pros. In the NFL, Derrick Johnson will be Julian Peterson at best, which isnt bad.

[dirno2000]

Scouting report I found on the web



Strengths: Has great closing speed and great tools in general. Plays with good instincts both in the running game and in coverage. Tall, can see over the line so he won’t fall for many play fakes. An excellent athlete who can fight through blocks and make plays look effortless. A walking defensive touchdown.

Concerns: Doesn’t keep containment or play with much discipline. Will need to be turned loose in the NFL to have early success. Doesn’t always tackle with great form but it didn’t hurt him in college. Sells himself out a little too much to make a play.

Overall: Johnson is the best pure athlete at the linebacker position since LaVar Arrington went second overall in the 2000 Draft to the Redskins. He also happens to remind many of Arrington because of the fact that he makes plays that few others can make but he doesn’t fit as well into some systems as other LBs because he needs to be turned loose. Johnson is the best athlete in the draft and should be a top-ten pick.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
His success will be at least partially based on the system he goes to, but the guy is just a freak of an athlete. He's already 230 and at 6'4 I'm sure he can carry 10 to 15 more pounds without much problem. As soon as he steps on the field, he'll be one of the fastest linebackers in the league. The question is, can he rush the passer? UT doesn't really use it's LB's to get pressure whereas that's all Suggs did in college.

[Fah Q]

Originally posted by: mavs413
LaVar Arrington, Brian Urlacher, & Peter Boulware were all great LBs in college and are all-pro currently.
Johnson has to be considered as the top LB in this draft, however, I dont think he will have close to the success in the NFL as they have had or like Terrell Suggs had last year. Derrick looks a little small(thin) and has trouble shedding blocks, so IMO, he cannot play strong side linebacker. He will not be able to just run around blockers in the NFL like he is currently doing now. His pass coverage will also need to improve.
Right now, I say he is a 10-13 pick in the 1st round. His college game is similar to what Chris Claiborne's was at USC, who was picked in the top 10 and hasnt done much in the Pros. In the NFL, Derrick Johnson will be Julian Peterson at best, which isnt bad.

Urlacher a LB in college? You lost all credibility there. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img] J/K actually he was a safety hybrid in college. Funny thing is I forgot completely about Arrington. He was one of the best college players I've seen and given that DJ is being compared to Arrington in that scouting report it still supports my arguement. Boulware was pretty damn good in college but he wasn't as good as the DJ during his years in school. Another guy I forgot about that was awesome in college and is getting feet wet in the NFL is Dan Morgan, I think that guy is a star in the making, I don't actually know why I brought him up it doesn't really support my does it?

But honestly, DJ looks like a Derrick Brooks clone who's taller and has more speed

BTW Peterson is awesome and only getting better.

[capitalcity]

Originally posted by: Fah Q

But honestly, DJ looks like a Derrick Brooks clone who's taller and has more speed

BTW Peterson is awesome and only getting better.

Q - ive been watching DJ and following the horns since 2000, and you're right DJ is damn good. He is always around the football and has a very Derrick Brooks-like way of playing the passing lanes. With his speed and athletisim (sp?) I have no doubt he'll be a probowl caliber NFL LB.

Depending on our draft position this whole argument may be moot - but despite how obviously special DJ is, i still believe CB is harder to address than LB (thru draft or free agency).

Again, I have watched and been impressed with DJ since he was a freshman - however it took me ONE GAME to see Antrel Rolle as an even more impressive talent. Vs. FSU he single handedly kept Miami in the ballgame and was everywhere making bigtime plays.

However there is still a lot of football to be played. We'll see if DJ steps it up against OU this year - i hope he does. It will tell me where his heart is at and maybe end the debate in my mind.

[alby]

gonna ask again..
how high do ya'll think benson will go in the draft?
he is tearing up right now and is on his way to a heisman if he performs well against ou

[capitalcity]

Originally posted by: alby
gonna ask again..
how high do ya'll think benson will go in the draft?
he is tearing up right now and is on his way to a heisman if he performs well against ou

Miami 0-3, Tampa Bay 0-3, San Fran 0-3, Arizona 0-3: all need a reliable RB

Heisman or not, it depends how he looks in personal workouts & at the combine - Cedric goes 6-12.

[Murphy3]

Unfortunately, Buffalo still has 2 games versus Miami and games against Arizona, Cleveland, Cincy, San Fran, and Pitts. Pittsburgh is a team that could either be prett good or an utter disappointment. I don't expect them to make the playoffs. Cleveland, Arizona, and Cincy should all be better than last year, but those are all winnable games for Buffalo.

[Just211]

Tampa Bay, Arizona. San Francisco, Miami, Kansas City and
BUFFALO are still winless..
Thats a top 6 pick, and Buffalo faces the Pats tomorrow so barring an upset, they'll keep their "perfect" season going.

BUT Tampa is playing Denver
Arizona is playing New Orleans
San Fran is playing St. Loius
Miami is playing the Jets
KC is playing Baltimore
so unfortunately it looks like at least 2 or 3 these teams will stay winless with them.

So this week it's GO PATS!!

[dirno2000]

Watched the Georgia-LSU game which featured the top two DE's in the draft. David Pollack looked damn good. Quick off the end, relentless pursuit and he held his own against the run for a player his size (265). Beside batting down an pass, Marcus Spears didn't do much. Of course some of the credit has to go to Georgia's O-line.

[Just211]

since we're looking at this draft stuff so early, it'll be interesting to watch names rise and fall out of the top of this draft. But it does look like there will be some good defensive players at the top ( Rolle, Johnson, Pollack)

[dirno2000]

Bledsoe just fumbled on a 4th and 2 in NE territory...touchdown Pats!!!

Buffalo falls to 0-3!

[dirno2000]

Teams that were winless at this point last season:

S.D. - 1st pick
Jax - 9th pick
Jets - 12th pick
Bears - 14th pick

Teams that were winless at this point in 2002:

Cincy - 1st pick
St Louis - 12th

Next up for the Bills: at NY Jets (-7)

[sike]

we may look back on this trade and praise the Cowboys front office.....lets just hope Julius turn out to be more than a fumble and injury waiting to happen....
keep losing Bills!

[Dooby]

Originally posted by: dirno2000
Teams that were winless at this point last season:

S.D. - 1st pick
Jax - 9th pick
Jets - 12th pick
Bears - 14th pick

Teams that were winless at this point in 2002:

Cincy - 1st pick
St Louis - 12th

Next up for the Bills: at NY Jets (-7)

Clarification: Is that through three games or four weeks?

[dirno2000]

Clarification: Is that through three games or four weeks?

It's through 4 weeks. The only one of those teams to have only played 3 games was the 2003 Bears. I probably should have pointed that out, but I'm trying to be optimistic here [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[FilthyFinMavs]

Originally posted by: sike
we may look back on this trade and praise the Cowboys front office.....lets just hope Julius turn out to be more than a fumble and injury waiting to happen....
keep losing Bills!

Even if we get the 30th pick in the draft next season it was still a great deal for the Cowboys. Just the fact we have another first rounder makes it a great deal for the Cowboys even if Julius doesn't turn out well.

[Dooby]

Originally posted by: FilthyFinMavs

Even if we get the 30th pick in the draft next season it was still a great deal for the Cowboys. Just the fact we have another first rounder makes it a great deal for the Cowboys even if Julius doesn't turn out well.

I disagree. For this to be a good trade, this needs to be a very high pick.

We traded a 2004 first for a 2005 first and a 2004 second. If you add all the 2004 and 2005 picks together, we netted a single second rounder; we didn't get an extra first rounder by any stretch of the imagination. If we got the 30th pick in the draft, we effectively traded the 20th pick in 2004 for the 30th pick in 2005 and a 2004 mid-second rounder. That isn't a good trade.

This deal hinges on the Bills sucking. Period.

[sike]

well, one first round pick traded for another in about the same location a year later is not something that really gets me excited....but if Jones turns out to be even just a good back and they get another first round pick(especially an early one) that will prove it to be a wonderful move. In other words, if by (passing on Steven Jackson and Greg Jones and) drafting Taking Julius Jones they get a good back and a high first round pick that will be great.

[giantbenmav]

as a non-biased football fan (Giants are my team) I think Pacells blew it by not taking Stephen Jackson....that kid is a stud.........Jones might be good, he has gamebreaker speed, and I dont think he is injury prone just had bad luck.....

pacells has no problem taking a top-tier LB when his team already has good LB's......remember he took Lawrence Talyor with the 2nd pick when the team already had Harry Carson AND Carl Banks!!!!

but Derrick Johnson is a stud...so is Antrelle Rolle......

[capitalcity]

Right now - i'm not very excited about julius. Come november i hope my opinion will change.

I believe in Big Bill and his choice of groceries. If picking a RB 40th was no different than choosing a RB at 20 than the move is justified.

However - we've yet to see if Kevin Jones and Stephen Jackson prove to be the real deal and julius flames out. Should that occur the trade must yield a selection in the top 10 for Parcells to escape scrutiny.

Dobby is right on - the Bills gotta suck bad for Parcells to come out smelling like a rose.

[Just211]

TOP 4 after 4 weeks

Tampa 0-4
San Fran 0-4
Miami 0-4
and the BUFFALO BILLS at 0-3



ANd IMO top 10 would be good, but to make it a really nice tradeable pick it probably needs to be top 5, maybe 6. And by tradeable, I mean to move up. Which I would really never see Bill doing, BUT having the option would be great

[Male30Dan]

Tampa will eventually win 6-8 games... Miami will win a couple on defense alone... San Fran will likely finish the season with the worst record... I think Buffalo has a very good chance of finishing with one of the worst records in football... I see no way possible for Dallas to get anything less than the #7 pick in next years draft!!!

[FilthyFinMavs]

Originally posted by: Dooby

I disagree. For this to be a good trade, this needs to be a very high pick.

We traded a 2004 first for a 2005 first and a 2004 second. If you add all the 2004 and 2005 picks together, we netted a single second rounder; we didn't get an extra first rounder by any stretch of the imagination. If we got the 30th pick in the draft, we effectively traded the 20th pick in 2004 for the 30th pick in 2005 and a 2004 mid-second rounder. That isn't a good trade.

This deal hinges on the Bills sucking. Period.

I guess it matters how much you think of Jones but I didn't think he was any better or any worse than Stephen Jackson or Greg Jones. So the fact that we got the Bills 2nd rounder which wasn't too far from our first rounder and an addiontional 1st rounder for this year to me was a great move by the Cowboys. If it's the last pick in the draft it's still a good deal for the Cowboys. I'd be pretty pissed if we did this deal and we were a lottery team last season but we weren't. We traded them a lower pick and in return got Julius Jones and an additional first rounder. That's a good deal.

[dirno2000]

Thanks to an Elway like drive by Chad Pennington with 3 minutes remaining, the Bill are now 0-4.

Of course, a terrible interception by Pennington set up the Bills' 1st touchdown of the game in the 4th quarter, but don't worry about that so much.