A former Mav might be an MVP fave, but don't count out Dirk - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

MavsFanFinley · 01-02-2005, 01:01 PM

In the running
A former Mav might be an MVP fave, but don't count out Dirk

By Art Garcia
Star-Telegram Staff Writer

A year ago, who would have thought Dirk Nowitzki would be an early-season MVP candidate?

Sure, better bets apply their trade in Phoenix, San Antonio and Miami, but just being mentioned in the MVP race is a testament to the kind of season the Mavericks' franchise player is having.

Nowitzki and Kevin Garnett, the reigning MVP, are the only players in the top 10 in scoring and rebounding. Nowitzki is the league's third-leading scorer, averaging a career-high 26.3 points per game, and he's pulling down 10.1 rebounds per game.

Asked if he should be an MVP candidate after two months of the season, Nowitzki simply said, "Nah." He pointed out the Mavs' 19-10 record and 9-6 mark at home. The Mavs return from a four-day break by hosting the Milwaukee Bucks tonight at American Airlines Center.

"We've lost too many games," Nowitzki said. "We've lost 10 games, and if we really want to be a good team, we can't lose all those home games.

"I shouldn't be in [the MVP race], but, hopefully, we'll continue to grow as a team, and we'll see what happens at the end of the year."

The trendy pick for early-season MVP is Nowitzki's best friend, Steve Nash. Not only is the mop-topped Canadian running away with the assists title, but the Suns own the league's best record (25-4).

"It's early, but the NBA MVP so far is the Suns' Steve Nash," said ESPN analyst Greg Anthony, a former NBA point guard. "He has had a huge impact. I would also have Tim Duncan and LeBron James on my short list. James in particular is defying convention with his ability and composure at such a young age."

Phoenix might have the best record but not be the best team. The Spurs appear the most dominant and complete, and two-time MVP Duncan is as efficient as ever.

Dwyane Wade might be the Heat's leading scorer, but there's little doubt the Diesel fuels the South Beach revival. Kobe Bryant surely has to miss 2000 MVP Shaquille O'Neal now.

James is no longer a teen-ager -- the boy king turned 20 Thursday -- and he's taken his game to the next level. The Cavaliers trail only Miami in the Eastern Conference.

Nowitzki, 26, isn't a favorite, but he's not an outsider, either. If anything, the fact that he led the league in scoring for 10 days this season had NBA observers talking about the 7-foot German. Nowitzki also owns the league's second highest scoring game of the season, a 53-point outburst against Houston a month ago.

"He's on the verge," said Mavs assistant Avery Johnson, a teammate of three former MVPs. "He's really close. From what I've seen, most of the MVPs come from one of the top three teams in the league. Us being one of the top teams in basketball would help him a whole lot."

The Mavs, despite their inconsistency, have a better record than Garnett's Timberwolves, James' Cavaliers and Bryant's Lakers.

"When considering MVP candidates, team success is extremely important," Anthony said. "I look for teams that are exceeding expectations. That gives you an advantage because a player's role -- the impact they have -- is an important part of it."

For the Mavs to be a championship-caliber team, Johnson said they need Nowitzki to play at a level worthy of serious MVP consideration. Take away Detroit last season and you have to go all the way back to the last Pistons title teams (1989 and '90) to find a champion without an MVP-type player.

"You have to remember that Detroit won it last year with a guy playing MVP-basketball in the playoffs in Chauncey Billups," Johnson said. "And they had Rasheed Wallace. You had 1A and 1B.

"Not only does Dirk need to play at the MVP level we need someone else to come from among the troops and play at a high level."

The knock on Nowitzki will continue to be defense, specifically the perception that he doesn't play any. Nowitzki is the first to admit that individual defense is the weakest part of his game, but those who watch him play every night see the improvement.

Nowitzki is working hard on the defensive end. He's moving his feet. He's bodying up. He's active in zone schemes, getting his hands in passing lanes. He's hitting the boards.

But reputations are slow to change. And, to be honest, Nowitzki won't ever be confused with Ron Artest. On or off the court.

"I would say Dirk is in the league's top five or six players in the MVP debate, but I want to see more on the defensive end from him," Anthony said. "I would also like to see continued improvement at making his teammates better. This is even more important now that Nash is no longer there with him."

Nowitzki's coach has noticed the progress, but Don Nelson reserves his early MVP vote for his former playmaker. But Nelson did mention potential obstacles for Nash.

"When's the last time a point guard has won the MVP? It usually doesn't happen," he said. "Not many small guards have ever won it."

Philadelphia's Allen Iverson, at 6 feet, was the smallest MVP, winning the award in 2001.

The only other MVP comparable in size to Nash was Boston's Bob Cousy (6-1), who won the honor in 1957. Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Oscar Robertson were bigger guards who won MVPs.

"It's a long way to go," Nelson said. "Right now, hey, I wouldn't argue with you if you want to make [Nash] the MVP of the league after 30 games."

Neither would Nowitzki.

MavsFanFinley · 01-02-2005, 01:01 PM

In the running
A former Mav might be an MVP fave, but don't count out Dirk

By Art Garcia
Star-Telegram Staff Writer

A year ago, who would have thought Dirk Nowitzki would be an early-season MVP candidate?

Sure, better bets apply their trade in Phoenix, San Antonio and Miami, but just being mentioned in the MVP race is a testament to the kind of season the Mavericks' franchise player is having.

Nowitzki and Kevin Garnett, the reigning MVP, are the only players in the top 10 in scoring and rebounding. Nowitzki is the league's third-leading scorer, averaging a career-high 26.3 points per game, and he's pulling down 10.1 rebounds per game.

Asked if he should be an MVP candidate after two months of the season, Nowitzki simply said, "Nah." He pointed out the Mavs' 19-10 record and 9-6 mark at home. The Mavs return from a four-day break by hosting the Milwaukee Bucks tonight at American Airlines Center.

"We've lost too many games," Nowitzki said. "We've lost 10 games, and if we really want to be a good team, we can't lose all those home games.

"I shouldn't be in [the MVP race], but, hopefully, we'll continue to grow as a team, and we'll see what happens at the end of the year."

The trendy pick for early-season MVP is Nowitzki's best friend, Steve Nash. Not only is the mop-topped Canadian running away with the assists title, but the Suns own the league's best record (25-4).

"It's early, but the NBA MVP so far is the Suns' Steve Nash," said ESPN analyst Greg Anthony, a former NBA point guard. "He has had a huge impact. I would also have Tim Duncan and LeBron James on my short list. James in particular is defying convention with his ability and composure at such a young age."

Phoenix might have the best record but not be the best team. The Spurs appear the most dominant and complete, and two-time MVP Duncan is as efficient as ever.

Dwyane Wade might be the Heat's leading scorer, but there's little doubt the Diesel fuels the South Beach revival. Kobe Bryant surely has to miss 2000 MVP Shaquille O'Neal now.

James is no longer a teen-ager -- the boy king turned 20 Thursday -- and he's taken his game to the next level. The Cavaliers trail only Miami in the Eastern Conference.

Nowitzki, 26, isn't a favorite, but he's not an outsider, either. If anything, the fact that he led the league in scoring for 10 days this season had NBA observers talking about the 7-foot German. Nowitzki also owns the league's second highest scoring game of the season, a 53-point outburst against Houston a month ago.

"He's on the verge," said Mavs assistant Avery Johnson, a teammate of three former MVPs. "He's really close. From what I've seen, most of the MVPs come from one of the top three teams in the league. Us being one of the top teams in basketball would help him a whole lot."

The Mavs, despite their inconsistency, have a better record than Garnett's Timberwolves, James' Cavaliers and Bryant's Lakers.

"When considering MVP candidates, team success is extremely important," Anthony said. "I look for teams that are exceeding expectations. That gives you an advantage because a player's role -- the impact they have -- is an important part of it."

For the Mavs to be a championship-caliber team, Johnson said they need Nowitzki to play at a level worthy of serious MVP consideration. Take away Detroit last season and you have to go all the way back to the last Pistons title teams (1989 and '90) to find a champion without an MVP-type player.

"You have to remember that Detroit won it last year with a guy playing MVP-basketball in the playoffs in Chauncey Billups," Johnson said. "And they had Rasheed Wallace. You had 1A and 1B.

"Not only does Dirk need to play at the MVP level we need someone else to come from among the troops and play at a high level."

The knock on Nowitzki will continue to be defense, specifically the perception that he doesn't play any. Nowitzki is the first to admit that individual defense is the weakest part of his game, but those who watch him play every night see the improvement.

Nowitzki is working hard on the defensive end. He's moving his feet. He's bodying up. He's active in zone schemes, getting his hands in passing lanes. He's hitting the boards.

But reputations are slow to change. And, to be honest, Nowitzki won't ever be confused with Ron Artest. On or off the court.

"I would say Dirk is in the league's top five or six players in the MVP debate, but I want to see more on the defensive end from him," Anthony said. "I would also like to see continued improvement at making his teammates better. This is even more important now that Nash is no longer there with him."

Nowitzki's coach has noticed the progress, but Don Nelson reserves his early MVP vote for his former playmaker. But Nelson did mention potential obstacles for Nash.

"When's the last time a point guard has won the MVP? It usually doesn't happen," he said. "Not many small guards have ever won it."

Philadelphia's Allen Iverson, at 6 feet, was the smallest MVP, winning the award in 2001.

The only other MVP comparable in size to Nash was Boston's Bob Cousy (6-1), who won the honor in 1957. Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Oscar Robertson were bigger guards who won MVPs.

"It's a long way to go," Nelson said. "Right now, hey, I wouldn't argue with you if you want to make [Nash] the MVP of the league after 30 games."

Neither would Nowitzki.

EricaLubarsky · 01-02-2005, 01:26 PM

who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

EricaLubarsky · 01-02-2005, 01:26 PM

who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

#41 · 01-02-2005, 01:36 PM

Right now, Greg Anthony is absolutely right, it's a battle of Steve vs. Duncan

#41 · 01-02-2005, 01:36 PM

Right now, Greg Anthony is absolutely right, it's a battle of Steve vs. Duncan

FilthyFinMavs · 01-02-2005, 03:11 PM

Yea I think it's Nash and Duncan's award to lose as of right now. I expect Nash to cool down a bit as the season progresses but maybe with the exception of Duncan I don't think any other play has more of an impact on a team. I see Dirk right now behind Lebron and AI right behind Dirk.

FilthyFinMavs · 01-02-2005, 03:11 PM

Yea I think it's Nash and Duncan's award to lose as of right now. I expect Nash to cool down a bit as the season progresses but maybe with the exception of Duncan I don't think any other play has more of an impact on a team. I see Dirk right now behind Lebron and AI right behind Dirk.

Murphy3 · 01-02-2005, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

........Virtually every Mavs fan would love for Dirk to be the MVP of the league. Obviously, finals MVP would be better, but your attitude towards being the league MVP makes little sense coming from a supposed Mavs fan.

Murphy3 · 01-02-2005, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

........Virtually every Mavs fan would love for Dirk to be the MVP of the league. Obviously, finals MVP would be better, but your attitude towards being the league MVP makes little sense coming from a supposed Mavs fan.

The Miles · 01-02-2005, 04:11 PM

What Murph said. The regular season MVP is something that lasts forever and defines a player as great throughout the ages. Not one NBA MVP that has been eligible to make the HOF hasn't made it. And Dirk being the MVP means the Mavs would have had a great last 2/3rds of the season and likely positioned themselves for the playoffs very nicely.

The Miles · 01-02-2005, 04:11 PM

What Murph said. The regular season MVP is something that lasts forever and defines a player as great throughout the ages. Not one NBA MVP that has been eligible to make the HOF hasn't made it. And Dirk being the MVP means the Mavs would have had a great last 2/3rds of the season and likely positioned themselves for the playoffs very nicely.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-02-2005, 05:15 PM

It's dumb that Dirk has to win the scoring title though. AI just shoots a million shots. Dirk is smart with his shots. Also, Dirk getting tons of points doens't mean success for our team, there I agree with Nellie. MVP should be about a team player. They talk about Dirk not getting MVP because of his defense but can anyone argue that Nash is better defensively then Dirk? Nash is top 10 worst defenders in the league, and there is no arguing that. Did you see Tony Parker the other night make almost every shot? Nash couldn't even pick him up for 3 seconds before being embarrased.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-02-2005, 05:15 PM

It's dumb that Dirk has to win the scoring title though. AI just shoots a million shots. Dirk is smart with his shots. Also, Dirk getting tons of points doens't mean success for our team, there I agree with Nellie. MVP should be about a team player. They talk about Dirk not getting MVP because of his defense but can anyone argue that Nash is better defensively then Dirk? Nash is top 10 worst defenders in the league, and there is no arguing that. Did you see Tony Parker the other night make almost every shot? Nash couldn't even pick him up for 3 seconds before being embarrased.

The Miles · 01-02-2005, 05:19 PM

Dallas is 10-0 when Dirk scores 30 or more so it is fair to say that Dirk scoring a lot is good for the team.

The Miles · 01-02-2005, 05:19 PM

Dallas is 10-0 when Dirk scores 30 or more so it is fair to say that Dirk scoring a lot is good for the team.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-02-2005, 05:53 PM

Well yes and no. If we depend on him to have the scoring load every night and then he gets injured, then we're in trouble.

DevinHarriswillstart · 01-02-2005, 05:53 PM

Well yes and no. If we depend on him to have the scoring load every night and then he gets injured, then we're in trouble.

EricaLubarsky · 01-02-2005, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

........Virtually every Mavs fan would love for Dirk to be the MVP of the league. Obviously, finals MVP would be better, but your attitude towards being the league MVP makes little sense coming from a supposed Mavs fan.

some people have a difficult time understanding rhetorical devices. I'm not going to assume that you do not, but your answer clearly shows that you did not understand my intention. And please do not question my fanhood. That is silly and immature and reflects poorly on you since there was nothing in my original post that provided evidence against the fact that I am a serious fan.

EricaLubarsky · 01-02-2005, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

........Virtually every Mavs fan would love for Dirk to be the MVP of the league. Obviously, finals MVP would be better, but your attitude towards being the league MVP makes little sense coming from a supposed Mavs fan.

some people have a difficult time understanding rhetorical devices. I'm not going to assume that you do not, but your answer clearly shows that you did not understand my intention. And please do not question my fanhood. That is silly and immature and reflects poorly on you since there was nothing in my original post that provided evidence against the fact that I am a serious fan.

Murphy3 · 01-02-2005, 07:55 PM

ahhh...poor erica. I'm not questioning your fanhood. I just find it funny that you're acting like caring about any award other than what comes in the post season is below you.

It's just humorous.....very poor attempt...but yeah, it was humorous to say the least.

Murphy3 · 01-02-2005, 07:55 PM

ahhh...poor erica. I'm not questioning your fanhood. I just find it funny that you're acting like caring about any award other than what comes in the post season is below you.

It's just humorous.....very poor attempt...but yeah, it was humorous to say the least.

EricaLubarsky · 01-02-2005, 08:03 PM

is that what I said?

EricaLubarsky · 01-02-2005, 08:03 PM

is that what I said?

poohrichardson · 01-03-2005, 02:49 AM

And the award for Most Defensive Member of the forum goes to.....

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
is that what I said?

poohrichardson · 01-03-2005, 02:49 AM

And the award for Most Defensive Member of the forum goes to.....

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
is that what I said?

dude1394 · 01-03-2005, 02:51 AM

Do NOT question my FANHOOD!!!! My manhood yes, but NOT my FANHOOD!!! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

dude1394 · 01-03-2005, 02:51 AM

Do NOT question my FANHOOD!!!! My manhood yes, but NOT my FANHOOD!!! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

bloodyhell · 01-03-2005, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

........Virtually every Mavs fan would love for Dirk to be the MVP of the league. Obviously, finals MVP would be better, but your attitude towards being the league MVP makes little sense coming from a supposed Mavs fan.

some people have a difficult time understanding rhetorical devices. I'm not going to assume that you do not, but your answer clearly shows that you did not understand my intention. And please do not question my fanhood. That is silly and immature and reflects poorly on you since there was nothing in my original post that provided evidence against the fact that I am a serious fan.

Hahaha eriCa takes another beating.

bloodyhell · 01-03-2005, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky

Quote:

Originally posted by: Murphy3

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

........Virtually every Mavs fan would love for Dirk to be the MVP of the league. Obviously, finals MVP would be better, but your attitude towards being the league MVP makes little sense coming from a supposed Mavs fan.

some people have a difficult time understanding rhetorical devices. I'm not going to assume that you do not, but your answer clearly shows that you did not understand my intention. And please do not question my fanhood. That is silly and immature and reflects poorly on you since there was nothing in my original post that provided evidence against the fact that I am a serious fan.

Hahaha eriCa takes another beating.

bloodyhell · 01-03-2005, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

What an inane and base statement.

bloodyhell · 01-03-2005, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by: EricaLubarsky
who cares about the regular season MVP. Dirk needs to work on finals MVP

What an inane and base statement.

bloodyhell · 01-03-2005, 06:58 AM

Dirk deserves mvp if he can keep it up and get the mavs up higher. His D has been greatly improved this year. More blocks, better movement. Tim duncan's one on one D leaves much to be desired imo.

bloodyhell · 01-03-2005, 06:58 AM

Dirk deserves mvp if he can keep it up and get the mavs up higher. His D has been greatly improved this year. More blocks, better movement. Tim duncan's one on one D leaves much to be desired imo.

jibikao · 01-03-2005, 03:19 PM

If Mavs is the Top 3 and Dirk has career stats, Dirk should win it.

It will help even more if Mavs is the #1 team because the current Dirk's stats is good enough.

Nash probably won't win but Amare could. I know Amare is not ready yet but his stats is just too good to ignore. I guess Nash/Amare is just like Malone/Stockton. Would you nominate one without the other?

Dirk is alone and Dirk doesn't have many star-players around him like Duncan, KG and Nash. Sure, Finely is great but I bet most people don't really consider him that good.

I am rooting for both Dirk and Nash, whoever win, doesn't matter.

Jimmy

jibikao · 01-03-2005, 03:19 PM

If Mavs is the Top 3 and Dirk has career stats, Dirk should win it.

It will help even more if Mavs is the #1 team because the current Dirk's stats is good enough.

Nash probably won't win but Amare could. I know Amare is not ready yet but his stats is just too good to ignore. I guess Nash/Amare is just like Malone/Stockton. Would you nominate one without the other?

Dirk is alone and Dirk doesn't have many star-players around him like Duncan, KG and Nash. Sure, Finely is great but I bet most people don't really consider him that good.

I am rooting for both Dirk and Nash, whoever win, doesn't matter.

Jimmy

Eman · 01-03-2005, 05:01 PM

All, please don't be so mean to intelligent people just stating their opinions.

If the Mav's end up with the best record in Basketball, or the 2nd best record and the team finishes the season with 20 wins or so in a row, Dirk will win it.

Eman · 01-03-2005, 05:01 PM

All, please don't be so mean to intelligent people just stating their opinions.

If the Mav's end up with the best record in Basketball, or the 2nd best record and the team finishes the season with 20 wins or so in a row, Dirk will win it.

SaltwaterChaffy · 01-03-2005, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: jibikao
I guess Nash/Amare is just like Malone/Stockton.

This makes me sad.

SaltwaterChaffy · 01-03-2005, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: jibikao
I guess Nash/Amare is just like Malone/Stockton.

This makes me sad.