Magic not sold on Mavs - Dallas-Mavs.com Forums

Zki41 · 10-17-2008, 09:45 AM

Magic Johnson isn’t sold on the Dallas Mavericks

http://www.star-telegram.com/287/story/980634.html

Quote:

By RAY BUCK
rbuck@star-telegram.com

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Magic Johnson believes the Dallas Mavericks could miss the playoffs for the first time in nine years.

That ball is still in the air ... and Josh Howard’s mug shot seems to be on it.

"I don’t know how long [Howard] can stay in Dallas," Johnson said. "The fans aren’t going to really tolerate a guy [like that] when you’re also losing at the same time."

Johnson, whose strong opinions and frank commentary are moving from TNT to ESPN/ABC this NBA season, emphasized he hopes Howard can overcome his latest in a series of "things that don’t make sense."

But the Magic Man holds out even less hope for the Mavs.

"To me, the biggest problem that the Dallas Mavericks have always had is that they’re not mentally tough," Johnson said on an ESPN teleconference earlier this week.

"And when you’re not mentally tough, and it comes to the playoffs ... you’re always going to lose."

That’s not a good prognosis for first-year Mavericks coach Rick Carlisle.

"If a team misses the playoffs, it’s a wasted season ... [and] that can possibly happen to Dallas," Johnson said. "How are the Mavericks going to be now that Houston is stronger with Ron Artest?

"How are the Mavericks even going to make a run for the playoffs when a lot of [Western Conference] teams got better, and I don’t think Dallas got better?"

Eight months ago, the Mavs swapped point guards — Devin Harris for Jason Kidd — as part of a blockbuster deal with New Jersey.

"That trade didn’t suit Dallas," Johnson said. "I thought Devin Harris was really a key to what the Mavs were trying to do. When they had that three-headed monster at guard — Jason Terry, Jerry Stackhouse and Devin Harris — they were tough to beat."

The Kidd trade last February came on the heels of the Lakers acquiring Pau Gasol from Memphis and the Suns acquiring Shaquille O’Neal from Miami.

"I think Dallas just reacted to everyone else making trades," Johnson said. "To me, [the Mavericks] are reactors instead of being an organization that sticks to the plan. ... Young players need to blossom."

After seven years at TNT, Johnson joins Stuart Scott, Michael Wilbon and Jon Barry on NBA Countdown on ABC, beginning Christmas Day.

Avery Johnson also joins ESPN/ABC as a studio analyst. The former Mavs coach will be paired with Bill Walton on ESPN’s NBA Shootaround pregame show.

Could’ve, would’ve, should’ve: Rapper/actor Chris "Ludacris" Bridges regrets that he left Adam "Pacman" Jones’ side before the ill-fated scuffle between Jones and his bodyguard at a Dallas hotel last week.

Bridges, who co-stars with Mark Wahlberg in the new movie, Max Payne, held a party that Jones attended.

"I was kickin’ it with him like the whole entire night," Bridges told ESPN’s Mike & Mike in the Morning. "Maybe I should’ve stayed with him a little bit longer. ... Then none of this would’ve happened.

"He’s chill, he’s cool when he’s around me."

Maybe Jerry Jones should’ve hired Bridges.
Ray Buck, 817-390-7760

This is one of those articles that everybody should hang up in the back of their lockers and look at each day before and after practice.

Granted.. some players should have more than just this hanging in the back of their locker.

Windmill360 · 10-17-2008, 09:54 AM

I'm not sold either.

SMC0007 · 10-17-2008, 09:55 AM

I would fight Magic right now.

He needs to just go and enjoy another bowl of HighV!

sike · 10-17-2008, 09:55 AM

Magic has proven over the years that when it comes to being a basketball mind and commentator, ......he sure was a great player.

erdubya · 10-17-2008, 10:10 AM

... And we care about Magic's opinion because???

Call me crazy if u want, but I say we're as good as anybody in the west.

Kidd Karma · 10-17-2008, 10:10 AM

A few years ago he and Ainge went at it during in studio commentary.

dalmations202 · 10-17-2008, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erdubya

... And we care about Magic's opinion because???

Call me crazy if u want, but I say we're as good as anybody in the west.

Bingo

ty · 10-17-2008, 10:13 AM

Never listen to Magic Johnson unless he's talking about blowing up the Death Star.

http://www.traileraddict.com/clip/fa...-harvest/magic

SeattleMavsFan · 10-17-2008, 10:15 AM

and we wonder why people that aren't mavs fans think we suck when people that supposedly know about basketball (like magic) say this stuff. why is he even talking about the mavs? he should just keep his mouth shut.

that's not to say that to an extent he is right. i'm not totally sold yet either. and i still think the devin harris for jason kidd trade was a mistake. but i highly doubt we'll miss the playoffs. and i'm so tired of people saying the mavs aren't mentally tough....

erdubya · 10-17-2008, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalmations202

Bingo

See, that's the problem man... so many of these "experts" are looking at the teams on paper. Where's the effort in that?

If the paper actually held up on court (no pun intended), then Houston would've went 82-0 last year and won the championship, & the lakers wouldn't even make the playoffs judging from their 'Paper' this time last year.

In short, it's all just a bunch of bs.

Kidd Karma · 10-17-2008, 10:49 AM

.....who picked the Hornets last year? Me hiding behind a computer can project the Jazz, Suns, Spurs, Lakers, Rockets, Hornets, Mavs and Blazers with Denver and GSW outside looking in......yea, blahblahblah. I think Denver's taken a huge step backwards losing Camby and not getting a viable replacement.

TripleDipping · 10-17-2008, 10:52 AM

Who's selling and who's buying?

Murphy3 · 10-17-2008, 11:02 AM

I wish Magic Johnson would take his AIDS elsewhere and get out of the public eye...

SMC0007 · 10-17-2008, 11:03 AM

WOW Thats harsh but totally called for......kinda where I was headed earlier

Stranger · 10-17-2008, 11:08 AM

From The Onion:

June 05, 2008
Magic Johnson Shares 'Thoughts' On Lakers-Celtics Finals

BOSTON—Appearing on ESPN's SportsCenter Wednesday, former Lakers point guard Magic Johnson provided his "thoughts," "insights," and "analysis" of the NBA Finals matchup between the Lakers and the Celtics, assuring viewers that the series will hinge on "whoever team does its things better more." "I think this, I think, this is really going to come down to basically overall game play and which team can win four or five games, and do it first," said the three-time NBA MVP, adding that scoring could also be as much of a major factor on the outcome as total points. "There's also a possible definite possibility of matchups occurring. Could happen, yeah. And we can't overlook the influence that—that that effect or effects, might have on something." When pressed by SportsCenter anchor Rece Davis as to which team was favored, Johnson responded by saying "the one that's going to win...Win the NBA championship."

Underdog · 10-17-2008, 11:44 AM

Quote:

That ball is still in the air ... and Josh Howard’s mug shot seems to be on it.

I love when articles start out with things that never happened - love or hate Josh Howard, the man has NEVER been arrested...

Quote:

"To me, the biggest problem that the Dallas Mavericks have always had is that they’re not mentally tough," Johnson said on an ESPN teleconference earlier this week.

"And when you’re not mentally tough, and it comes to the playoffs ... you’re always going to lose."

We weren't mentally tough when we beat the Spurs & Suns to get to the Finals in '06???

I guess it was dumb luck...

Although, I've heard that the NBA is too competitive for a team to simply "luck" their way into the Finals (but it was Pat Riley who said that - what does he know about basketball compared to Magic Johnson???)

Quote:

"That trade didn’t suit Dallas," Johnson said. "I thought Devin Harris was really a key to what the Mavs were trying to do. When they had that three-headed monster at guard — Jason Terry, Jerry Stackhouse and Devin Harris — they were tough to beat."

Jerry Stackhouse??? This is proof that Magic hasn't watched a Mavs game (or Stackhouse) for the past 3 years...

Quote:

"I think Dallas just reacted to everyone else making trades," Johnson said. "To me, [the Mavericks] are reactors instead of being an organization that sticks to the plan. ... Young players need to blossom."

How many years do you wait for "young players" to blossom while your SUPERSTAR is slipping past his prime??? If we kept Devin, then we should have traded Dirk...

DavidDaMonkey · 10-17-2008, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

Magic has proven over the years that when it comes to being a basketball mind and commentator, ......he sure was a great player.

I'm trying to rep you for this, but the rep-inator seems to be malfunctioning.

sike · 10-17-2008, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidDaMonkey

I'm trying to rep you for this, but the rep-inator seems to be malfunctioning.

don't worry David, I'm pretty great...you'll have plenty of opportunities.

Usually Lurkin · 10-17-2008, 12:02 PM

well, I'll agree that the mavs have not been mentally tough in their last few playoff series. GS was total mental weakness. And they just looked like they lacked heart last year.

But his examples of mental toughness is Houston?? TMac and Ming are the mentally weakest top 2 anywhere. And Ron Artest does nothing but confuse crazy with toughness.

If the problem is mental toughness, how does Harris for Kidd not help? Losing Harris hurts a team that isn't mentally tough?? The guy never looked less scared than a kitten after a dryer spin.

He is right about JHo. If that guy doesn't straighten out on the court, his off-court idiocies will be magnified, and everything will be tougher for the Mavs.

SMC0007 · 10-17-2008, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

don't worry David, I'm pretty great...you'll have plenty of opportunities.

I tried to rep for the same thing and ran into the same problem. Sike broke the rep-inator with greatness. < Possibly a new sig?

sike · 10-17-2008, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMC0007

I tried to rep for the same thing and ran into the same problem. Sike broke the rep-inator with greatness. < Possibly a new sig?

sheesh.

sike · 10-17-2008, 12:23 PM

How many Trip Dubs is Kidd behind Magic?

Underdog · 10-17-2008, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sike

How many Trip Dubs is Kidd behind Magic?

All-time leaders:

Oscar Robertson - 181
Magic Johnson - 138
Jason Kidd - 100
Wilt Chamberlain - 78
Larry Bird - 59

The fact that 5th place has 1/3 the amount of triple-doubles as 1st place illustrates how hard it is to achieve in the NBA...

craggmac · 10-17-2008, 01:26 PM

Who would we have to aquire to become mentally tough?

SMC0007 · 10-17-2008, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craggmac

Who would we have to aquire to become mentally tough?

This dood!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MdaP0_gyQk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cprMX...eature=related

LonghornDub · 10-17-2008, 04:33 PM

I'm not "sold on the Mavs" in terms of them being a championship caliber team, but I'm sold that they will make the playoffs.

MavsWiLLHaVeRinGs · 10-17-2008, 05:47 PM

It seems like these analysts go out of their way to mention the Mavs. It's like to cool thing to do, diss the Mavs. If you don't hate the Mavs you're not doing your job. It seems like if we suck so bad and can't even make the playoffs we wouldn't even be worth mentioning, like the Hawks.

sike · 10-17-2008, 05:59 PM

Why should anyone not bleeding purple and gold care what he has to say?

Rick41 · 10-17-2008, 06:43 PM

I forgot about magic once he retired. He's back? Whats going on? I noticed a full article up the page that makes no sense to me.

Bayliss · 10-17-2008, 08:09 PM

Magic just needs to

twistaeffect2004 · 10-17-2008, 09:00 PM

I mean, is he out of line to think that? I think this Mavs team does have a lot of question marks and a lot of teams have improved coming into this season, so I'm not surprised at all that experts or whatever you'd like to call them have soured on the Mavs.

The whole "mental toughness" thing is a dumb argument why, but we just might not be as talented as some of the other top teams in the West this season.

Bayliss · 10-17-2008, 09:03 PM

It isn't that he thought the Mavs didn't have talent, etc. It is that he hasn't studied the Mavs enough to draw up an intelligent reason for his criticism.

It's like a 12 year old saying they hate lima beans, yet they have never tasted them. They assume they won't because it is a vegetable, they don't like vegetables, and by god their friend down the streets doesn't like them too!

twistaeffect2004 · 10-17-2008, 09:08 PM

Ah, ok I get what you're saying Bayliss. And I do agree that his reasoning is dumb. I've never ever believed the mental toughness thing. Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom were considered pansies (epsecially Gasol) and they made it to the finals last season. Talent overcomes everything. Whether the Mavs have enough to hang with the big dogs this season is up to question.

dirno2000 · 10-17-2008, 09:59 PM

I think Magic is being a little harsh here. Probably because of his relationship with Avery. However he's not, as some suggested, only looking at the West on paper. He's seen this team play and it wasn't that great. If we play like we did post trade we'll be close enough to the 8/9 seed that the wrong injury could push us out of the playoffs. (Actually if we're that close I hope we end up 9th or 10th while we still have our pick...but that's another discussion altogether.)

We should probably get used to this type of analysis since anyone that thinks we're a player in the West race is probably basing it on three things:

1) Avery was an inept coach and Carlisle is an above average coach
2) It was Avery's ineptitude, and not age, that rendered Kidd fairly ordinary last year
3) Either Gerald Green or Antoine Wright is going to become a starting caliber 2/3 on a good team.

Granted, those three things could indeed be true and we wouldn't be fans if we didn't believe that there was at least a chance. That being said, few people outside of Dallas believe any of it and honestly I wouldn't either if I weren't so emotionally connected to the team.

Murphy3 · 10-17-2008, 10:03 PM

I think that most that actually followed the team closely can see that avery was totally inept. How much of a difference will that make? I really don't know. But, that's a reason why people take outsiders viewpoints with a huge grain of salt. They really didn't watch on a game by game basis to see just how inept AJ was...

LonghornDub · 10-18-2008, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirno2000

I think Magic is being a little harsh here. Probably because of his relationship with Avery. However he's not, as some suggested, only looking at the West on paper. He's seen this team play and it wasn't that great. If we play like we did post trade we'll be close enough to the 8/9 seed that the wrong injury could push us out of the playoffs. (Actually if we're that close I hope we end up 9th or 10th while we still have our pick...but that's another discussion altogether.)

Really? When did he see this team play? In a preseason game?

Last year's team is not this year's team. Similar rosters, similar starters, but not the same team by any stretch. Now, that doesn't guarantee that this team will be much, if any, better, but a completely different coach means that any comparisons to last year are tenuous at best.

EricaLubarsky · 10-18-2008, 12:55 AM

Pundit doesnt like team x, thread made about it.

dirno2000 · 10-18-2008, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Really? When did he see this team play? In a preseason game?

He saw them play last year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornDumb

Last year's team is not this year's team. Similar rosters, similar starters, but not the same team by any stretch. Now, that doesn't guarantee that this team will be much, if any, better, but a completely different coach means that any comparisons to last year are tenuous at best.

How differently do you look at Det. since they replaced Saunders with Curry? If you're like me not much if at all. The only reason to take a coaching change into consideration when analyzing a team is if you think the new coach is significantly better than the old one or vice versa.

I realize he hasn't seen this exact set of players with this coach but when you consider the only significant (based on accomplishments) on court addition was Diop I don't see the problem with using last years post All-Star break team to predict what this team will do. The same goes for the Lakers, the Jazz N.O. and the other Western Conference powers that didn't add and All Star caliber player. The data he's using isn't perfect but for better or worse people want to hear his opinion now.

ghazi · 10-18-2008, 04:13 AM

Let's assume Magic is right and the Mavs did not make upgrades this offseason.

Well we were 7th last year, Nuggets were 8th... Warriors 9th... Blazers 10th.

Blazers have improved, Nuggets and Warriors definitely got worse. Clippers acquired Davis and Camby but lost Brand, and are probably a 35-40 win team at best.

So which TWO teams are going to leap the Mavs as far as the playoffs? Dumb, barring injuries or some sort of anomalous meltdown, the Mavs are making the playoffs (and winning a championship)

left texas · 10-18-2008, 07:17 AM

http://proxy.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/020927[/URL]