PGT: Just too stupid

[Kante]

24 turnovers, everytime the Mavs got closer they comitted one. Frustrating, looked like they did not wanted to win.

Good thing, it was not a blowout! Tomorrow another game in Florida...

[Vinsanity]

Just out of curiosity, I wonder what the winning percentage is of the team that has fewer turnovers... It's gotta be like 95%. Turnovers is always the key, and was clearly the reason we lost tonight.

[some1nw]

this game ended like i expected. They are the better team by far, and any time lebron and wade shoots like that they can beat any team. But wade was a little too extra

[LonghornDub]

Frankly, I'm pretty impressed the Mavs lost by only 6 with Lebron hitting 14-18 and the Mavs having 24 turnovers.

[Cerberus]

More than anything, our defense will lose us games, we are very capable offensively. We're not going to commit 24 turnovers every game. We can compete with the best.

[adonis]

Monta Ellis makes Jason Terry look like prime Steve Nash in terms of BBIQ.

[GhostOfAdamMorrison]

VC, Blair, and Crowder were all -15. Really no reason Dally didn't play more than 20 minutes. Also, Marion could have used a few more. Ellis is going to lead the NBA in turnovers and his defense is pretty awful. Not sure what the infatuation here is with him. Even though his TS% is good right now (for him), his ORtg is terrible, which is in line with the eye test for me...

[Bayliss]

Team will be frustrating at times but I do like the heart and effort from this bunch as opposed to the sh*t that out there last year.

Turnovers were a huge problem tonight. The Mavs best stretch was in the 3rd when Dalembert and Marion and Dirk guarded the rim very well. They were blocking some shots, rebounding. Mavs went away from success in crunch time.

[MaverickGold]

Originally Posted by Vinsanity

Just out of curiosity, I wonder what the winning percentage is of the team that has fewer turnovers... It's gotta be like 95%. Turnovers is always the key, and was clearly the reason we lost tonight.

On my phone, or I would look it up. But the way Westbrook fumbles it repeatedly, I wouldn't be surprised to see okc winning a bunch of games where they lose the TO battle.

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by LonghornDub

Frankly, I'm pretty impressed the Mavs lost by only 6 with Lebron hitting 14-18 and the Mavs having 24 turnovers.

Bron-Bron being Bron-Bron... No shame in this loss, he went the 'eff off. He does that.

Dirk and Monta's turnovers didn't help, but LeBron had 6 himself (game high)... Basketball.

[Bayliss]

Dirk and Monta's turnovers didn't help, but LeBron had 6 himself... Basketball.

Can't control what the ball do.

[markus1234]

Hm...let's see

http://espn.go.com/nba/playbyplay?ga...89003&period=4

1:44 Official timeout
1:43 99-102 DeJuan Blair vs. Dwyane Wade (Chris Bosh gains possession)
1:43 Jose Calderon bad pass (Dwyane Wade steals) 99-102
1:24 DeJuan Blair shooting foul (Dwyane Wade draws the foul) 99-102
1:24 99-102 Dwyane Wade misses free throw 1 of 2
1:24 99-102 Heat offensive team rebound
1:24 99-102 Dwyane Wade misses free throw 2 of 2
1:22 Vince Carter defensive rebound 99-102
1:00 Monta Ellis misses 25-foot three point jumper 99-102
0:59 99-102 Chris Bosh defensive rebound
0:59 DeJuan Blair personal foul (Chris Bosh draws the foul) 99-102

...I see no Dirk.

He did not even touch the ball in the last 2min. If it does not change in the future it is on the coach.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Ha, we lose a close game to the NBA champs and of course the Ellis haters come out. Typical.

[GhostOfAdamMorrison]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Ha, we lose a close game to the NBA champs and of course the Ellis haters come out. Typical.

There are no Ellis haters. In fact, this board seems to love him. Ellis is what he is. A very inefficient player who doesn't really boost a team's offense. He has a career ORtg of 104. That's absolutely insane.

He'd be a very nice scoring guard off the bench...

[jleefilled]

Originally Posted by Underdog

Bron-Bron being Bron-Bron... No shame in this loss, he went the 'eff off. He does that.

Dirk and Monta's turnovers didn't help, but LeBron had 6 himself (game high)... Basketball.

That might have been the best I've seen LeBron play. He was great.

It's early in the season. That Heat squad has been together winning championships for a while now. The Mavs are going to be a work in progress for maybe the entire season. I just hope they make the tournament with a healthy team and some semblance of decent defense.

[dude1394]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Ha, we lose a close game to the NBA champs and of course the Ellis haters come out. Typical.

Nobody hates him but holding the ball for 22 seconds and then jacking up that crap is one boneheaded play, I tell you what.

[DavidDaMonkey]

Originally Posted by GhostOfAdamMorrison

There are no Ellis haters. In fact, this board seems to love him. Ellis is what he is. A very inefficient player who doesn't really boost a team's offense. He has a career ORtg of 104. That's absolutely insane.

He'd be a very nice scoring guard off the bench...

I don't know much about ORtg, but from what I understand it's not entirely relevant to say that Ellis's not really boosting a team's offense is related to his ORtg. The fact that teams have to respect him anywhere on the floor, from the 3pt line to drives into the paint, changes the game for the rest of the Mavericks on the floor and consistently gets them better shots in ways that ORtg doesn't measure. Whether he is making his shots or not is a different issue. I figure his "hockey assists" as well as his ability to collapse defenses is having a larger impact than you may be accounting for.

For what it's worth, Ellis is currently tied for 8th in the league in secondary assists per game (Go SportVU!)

[dude1394]

Ellis obviously helps the offense, the mavs offense is fine. End of games and defense will tell the story this year.

[Jproxursoxoff]

Posted this in the GDT unaware that this one had already been made...

...But anyway it was a great game. Almost felt like playoff basketball. I guess in the end it came down to the 24 turnovers. EVERYONE was sloppy with the ball. Dirk and Ellis had 5 each. Mekel (who was atrocious in the 5 mins he was in) Carter and Calderon had 3 each.

But offensively this is the kind of game Ive been waiting for from Dirk. He was extremely efficient. And he got calls all night. He and Carter (who also sank a one-legged fade) had great games. Calderon made 4 threes but had the same number of assists as Blair?? I was also suprised Blair closed out the game instead of Daly. Perhaps RC thinks Blair is better offensively?

[adonis]

Originally Posted by dude1394

End of games and defense will tell the story this year.

It's been the same story since the end of the lockout. Doesn't look like anything's changing.

[GhostOfAdamMorrison]

Originally Posted by DavidDaMonkey

I don't know much about ORtg, but from what I understand it's not entirely relevant to say that Ellis's not really boosting a team's offense is related to his ORtg. The fact that teams have to respect him anywhere on the floor, from the 3pt line to drives into the paint, changes the game for the rest of the Mavericks on the floor and consistently gets them better shots in ways that ORtg doesn't measure. Whether he is making his shots or not is a different issue. I figure his "hockey assists" as well as his ability to collapse defenses is having a larger impact than you may be accounting for.

For what it's worth, Ellis is currently tied for 8th in the league in secondary assists per game (Go SportVU!)

Look, it's no coincidence that Ellis had his highest TS% and ORtg BY FAR when he come off the bench for GS in 07' (the year they upset us).

Teams DON'T have to respect him from the three-point line. He's simply not a good jump shooter. Will he hit some? Sure. At a low clip. He is indeed an underrated passer. But he's also very sloppy with the ball. He simply doesn't do enough good things on offense to negate the bad (and his defense) to be a starting SG on an elite team. But, we aren't an elite team. Off the bench, he'd be fantastic.

[sike]

Losing by 6 in Miami on a night where LeBron goes off and the Mavs treat the ball like a hot potato? Not bad for a team still trying to come together.

I appreciate fans who can operate with some perspective.

[Underdog]

Originally Posted by sike

Losing by 6 in Miami on a night where LeBron goes off and the Mavs treat the ball like a hot potato? Not bad for a team still trying to come together.

I appreciate fans who can operate with some perspective.

+1

[GhostOfAdamMorrison]

Originally Posted by sike

Losing by 6 in Miami on a night where LeBron goes off and the Mavs treat the ball like a hot potato? Not bad for a team still trying to come together.

I appreciate fans who can operate with some perspective.

Wouldn't matter if we won or lost. I'm just stating the obvious. Btw, in the gamethread I saw someone mention rumors of a Turner-Marion trade? What was the source on that? I'd be thrilled with that deal.

[Vinsanity]

Wow, just realized Wade had 8 steals... Seems like everyone on their team had at least 8 steals smh

[Jproxursoxoff]

Originally Posted by Vinsanity

Wow, just realized Wade had 8 steals... Seems like everyone on their team had at least 8 steals smh

Yeah I dont think Ive ever seen a Mavs game when they were THIS sloppy with the ball.

[yahyes]

From what I saw. We our in need of Devin to comeback badly. Mekel couldn't hang against a upper winning team like the heat. Mavs were lacking a backup PG to help ball control. I'm hoping we have our full roster by December set.

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by sike

Losing by 6 in Miami on a night where LeBron goes off and the Mavs treat the ball like a hot potato? Not bad for a team still trying to come together.

I appreciate fans who can operate with some perspective.

Gosh, if only perspective were the norm around here.

[G-Man]

Tough crowd here tonight.

That, with 1 minute left, the Mavs were down by 3 and had the ball says a lot of good things about this team. We were up against the world champs...a very good defensive team that has been together a long time, and has a lot of experience defending Dirk. Plus, we were in their place. The only place our backup Pg had ever played LeBron or Wade was on his X-box, so give the kid a break.

The turnovers can be fixed. Few teams are better at forcing them than Miami, and our team just hasn't been together long enough to be that good against ball hawks. Carlisle will clean this up. Here I must take issue with the Monta-bashers. The kid has court vision. He's making a lot of passes that are not quite perfect, to guys who aren't quite ready for them...I expect that to get much better over time.

If we can challenge the Heat in their building, then we ought to be good enough to beat some pretty good teams on the road, and to challenge anybody at our place. For a team with a foreign rookie PG and 3 new starters, thats not a bad place to be after less than a month into the season.

[twelli]

Overall not a bad game, great how the team got back the lead after loosing it after a good start and being behind by 14. What I like about the Mavs is that they are a veteran team that doesn't panic most of the time, save for some ill-advised three point attempts early in the shot clock here and there. I don't think we lost because we had so many turnovers but because we had too many BAD turnovers, those at the 3-pt line leading to easy pts at the other end. Took the ball handlers too long to adjust to their aggressive defense. Blair wasn't bad but tried a bit too hard to score on some possessions. Could have needed some points from Crowder. I liked Vince on offense.

[Kante]

I really hate CadBane.

[Aggie E]

Ellis is the only perimeter player that can get into the lane with the ball on this team. that alone makes him important.

[DGM]

Originally Posted by DevinHarriswillstart

Ha, we lose a close game to the NBA champs and of course the Ellis haters come out. Typical.

Can you believe it? Monta is playing well and too many minutes.

[oilfieldtrash]

I'm just wondering what's disappointing about Ellis? Is it the contract? 8 mil a year is probably the steal of the entire nba off-season for a top 10 scorer. Did you expect Monta to go 2011 Dirk last night and beat the heat at their house? You guys are expecting an awful lot.

[sike]

+rep

Originally Posted by G-Man

Tough crowd here tonight.

That, with 1 minute left, the Mavs were down by 3 and had the ball says a lot of good things about this team. We were up against the world champs...a very good defensive team that has been together a long time, and has a lot of experience defending Dirk. Plus, we were in their place. The only place our backup Pg had ever played LeBron or Wade was on his X-box, so give the kid a break.

The turnovers can be fixed. Few teams are better at forcing them than Miami, and our team just hasn't been together long enough to be that good against ball hawks. Carlisle will clean this up. Here I must take issue with the Monta-bashers. The kid has court vision. He's making a lot of passes that are not quite perfect, to guys who aren't quite ready for them...I expect that to get much better over time.

If we can challenge the Heat in their building, then we ought to be good enough to beat some pretty good teams on the road, and to challenge anybody at our place. For a team with a foreign rookie PG and 3 new starters, thats not a bad place to be after less than a month into the season.

[vinylstar]

Those to's were more a product of amazing permiter defense than sloppiness. Miami contained the ball handler and had all his outs covered. That was amazing to watch. Rick loves perimeter pnr and given the talent on the team it usually works but against that team I think the Mavs would have been better served just finding the favorable matchup and isolating....Avery style.

[Sportstudi]

Originally Posted by sike

Losing by 6 in Miami on a night where LeBron goes off and the Mavs treat the ball like a hot potato? Not bad for a team still trying to come together.

I appreciate fans who can operate with some perspective.

Exactly. Without those TO's that could have been a different game despite Bron going berzerk. I like the effort of the team. No comparison to the crap from last year with a backcourt of Collison, James and Mayo. Blair is undersized, but his effort triples the one given by the Caveman. And Dalembert is better than Brand.

The team is still gelling, this needs some time. And once Wright and Harris are back this is only going to be better. I think it's definitely in reach to make the playoffs, no doubt. However, the TO's have to stop (we already had quite some nights like this) and Dirk needs to get the ball more often in crunch time. Somehow Ellis and even Blair are more able to find Dirk than our PG Calderon.

[Sportstudi]

Originally Posted by Kante

I really hate CadBane.

Who likes him?

[DevinHarriswillstart]

Originally Posted by Kante

I really hate CadBane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYOA_ciyS6c

[Melonhead]

I really hate Chalmers. Such a piece of shit, always throwing cheap shots. His excuse was he didnt even see Dirk but was trying to get his arm free from Dalembert. Smug ass punk