Raef and Jiri and a #1..... for Terry?

[jayC]

Raef has never avgd more then 7 rebounds in a season. The mavs were still looking for the answer with Raef. If you recall the mavs spent the entire summer hunting down ZO two years ago. Arguing about stuff that is in the past is counterproductive. Dampier has performed well, the defense is much better.

When did Raef ever have 7 dunks in a game. Does he have a post game at all? NO is he a good rebounder for a 7 footer no. He didn't fit here that is the bottom line. Damp's base contract is 6 years for 59 million that is less then Raef is stealing. Bird, Kiki, Isiah all wanted Dampier, who exactly wanted Raef. The third wheel wanted Raef. Raef isn't avging 28ppg hellboy. Relax, happy new year and enjoy the ride. This team is on a pace to win 55 games not to bad at all. Stats don't lie this is the best defensive maverick team of the nellie era. Dude and Hellboy stop living in the past.

[dude1394]

Dude at least look up the stats. Raefs CAREER average is 7.00. And that includes the down year with the mavs.

7.6, 7.9, 7.8, 7.4, 7.4, 7.4, 4.8(Dallas and hurt it seems), 4.6 (hurt) and now 8.1.

Hell I don't know if he had 7 dunks in a game, I also don't EVER remember raef being positioned anywhere but at the 3pt line. I would imagine he has had 7 dunks but they were probably also on the break and not because he was hanging around the basket (which he never did with nellie).

I don't exactly call what Damp is throwing out there that great of a post game. He's strong and I like him for a center. I just like Raef as good or better, if he's healthy which he seems to be now.

You can get all pissy about a Raef/Damp debate and living in the past and all that crapola, but we are just debating relative players. Right now Raef's stats are outshinging damps by a mile right now. The mavs defense is better, but that is easily as attributable to terry, josh, devin and not have stevie/nve as it is to anything damp is doing. Damp is really nice against great big centers as he doesn't get pushed around which is a good.

And I like the team as it's constructed now versus last years cluster, but I do not believe it's that much more competitive than the 2002 team. We will find out, but right now the SCOREBOARD is on my side.

[dude1394]

Dude at least look up the stats. Raefs CAREER average is 7.00. And that includes the down year with the mavs.

7.6, 7.9, 7.8, 7.4, 7.4, 7.4, 4.8(Dallas and hurt it seems), 4.6 (hurt) and now 8.1.

Hell I don't know if he had 7 dunks in a game, I also don't EVER remember raef being positioned anywhere but at the 3pt line. I would imagine he has had 7 dunks but they were probably also on the break and not because he was hanging around the basket (which he never did with nellie).

I don't exactly call what Damp is throwing out there that great of a post game. He's strong and I like him for a center. I just like Raef as good or better, if he's healthy which he seems to be now.

You can get all pissy about a Raef/Damp debate and living in the past and all that crapola, but we are just debating relative players. Right now Raef's stats are outshinging damps by a mile right now. The mavs defense is better, but that is easily as attributable to terry, josh, devin and not have stevie/nve as it is to anything damp is doing. Damp is really nice against great big centers as he doesn't get pushed around which is a good.

And I like the team as it's constructed now versus last years cluster, but I do not believe it's that much more competitive than the 2002 team. We will find out, but right now the SCOREBOARD is on my side.

[bloodyhell]

DampQueer is a crap center. Cuban is a fool for going after him without scouting him first. He's been a disapointment to say the least.

[bloodyhell]

DampQueer is a crap center. Cuban is a fool for going after him without scouting him first. He's been a disapointment to say the least.

[endtroducing]

leave this site.

[endtroducing]

leave this site.

[PubaNWO]

Raef is at 8 rebs per because he plays with Mark freaking Blount!!!!

Paul Pierce gets as many if not more rebounds than Mark Blount!!!!

And by the way, Raef is playing very well on the C's. He's not bad for a one legged softy, but he is super bad at the price we are paying him.

[PubaNWO]

Raef is at 8 rebs per because he plays with Mark freaking Blount!!!!

Paul Pierce gets as many if not more rebounds than Mark Blount!!!!

And by the way, Raef is playing very well on the C's. He's not bad for a one legged softy, but he is super bad at the price we are paying him.

[dude1394]

Raef IS at 8 rebounds.........period....

Again why did raef average 7.4 rebounds during the 27 games after his trade to dallas? Was it because he was playing with Dirk freaking Nowitzki? What the heck point are you making here? Try again.

I've heard this before that somehow the person you play with makes a "HUGE" difference in rebounding? I'd like to see this proven with some data, I don't see it. Dirk last year for example had about a 1 rebound/game dropoff by playing with walker.

So I'm waiting for the 4 reb/game dropoff statistics based on the other player, it's BS!!!.

[dude1394]

Raef IS at 8 rebounds.........period....

Again why did raef average 7.4 rebounds during the 27 games after his trade to dallas? Was it because he was playing with Dirk freaking Nowitzki? What the heck point are you making here? Try again.

I've heard this before that somehow the person you play with makes a "HUGE" difference in rebounding? I'd like to see this proven with some data, I don't see it. Dirk last year for example had about a 1 rebound/game dropoff by playing with walker.

So I'm waiting for the 4 reb/game dropoff statistics based on the other player, it's BS!!!.

[Pirate]

A certain number of rebounds a game does not make a person a center, or a non-center. Stats dont tell the tale of a person's ability to blend with other players, to make the team better.

Raef LaFrentz is a 4. Teams have wanted him to be a 5, but he never has been. He just doesnt have those skills. Does that make him a bad player? Nope, but it makes him someone who doesnt fit on a team that has a 4 that is even better. As we saw last year, multiple 4s next to Dirk dont work.

Dampier is a 5. He plays the middle. That is what Dirk needs to complement his game, and it is why Dampier is far better for this team than LaFrentz could ever hope to be.

[Pirate]

A certain number of rebounds a game does not make a person a center, or a non-center. Stats dont tell the tale of a person's ability to blend with other players, to make the team better.

Raef LaFrentz is a 4. Teams have wanted him to be a 5, but he never has been. He just doesnt have those skills. Does that make him a bad player? Nope, but it makes him someone who doesnt fit on a team that has a 4 that is even better. As we saw last year, multiple 4s next to Dirk dont work.

Dampier is a 5. He plays the middle. That is what Dirk needs to complement his game, and it is why Dampier is far better for this team than LaFrentz could ever hope to be.

[dude1394]

Say that raef is a 4 again some more, it really helps the arguement, if it's said enough, then maybe I will believe it truly.

Surely Dampier IS a 5, because that's all he could do or could be.

If you are considering walker as a viable center then I just don't understand where you are coming from? Obviously walker (at 6'9") was not equipped to be a center,he just couldn't contest shots like you want down there.

However a guy 6'11", 250-260 lbps CAN man the center position especially if he is a natural shot-blocker.

He may not be the brute center that you consider a traditional center is, but it is still my contention that he was enough "center" for the mavs all the while providing other things that "most" centers do not have.

Nesterovic is a great example. He IS a center... Repeat after me...HE IS A CENTER..However. He's NOT a big brute and he can hit a 12-15 footer. If HE is a center, what does he have that raef does not?

[dude1394]

Say that raef is a 4 again some more, it really helps the arguement, if it's said enough, then maybe I will believe it truly.

Surely Dampier IS a 5, because that's all he could do or could be.

If you are considering walker as a viable center then I just don't understand where you are coming from? Obviously walker (at 6'9") was not equipped to be a center,he just couldn't contest shots like you want down there.

However a guy 6'11", 250-260 lbps CAN man the center position especially if he is a natural shot-blocker.

He may not be the brute center that you consider a traditional center is, but it is still my contention that he was enough "center" for the mavs all the while providing other things that "most" centers do not have.

Nesterovic is a great example. He IS a center... Repeat after me...HE IS A CENTER..However. He's NOT a big brute and he can hit a 12-15 footer. If HE is a center, what does he have that raef does not?

[Pirate]

You keep making the same arguments (he has the size) and asking the same question (why wouldnt he have worked here as a 5) so the answer remains the same and keeps being repeated when you keep repeating the question (because he is a 4, not a 5, and the Mavs need a 5 to complement Dirk).

You seem to think that a 5 is defined by size, but it is not. And where did anyone say that Walker was feasible as a 5? He was also a 4, playing the 5 badly.

You keep saying LaFrentz CAN do the job, merely because he is tall and can block shots. Dirk is taller, and he also can block shots. But he is not a 5 either (regardless of how Coach Nelson tries to use him sometimes).

Nesterovic is a center. A mediocre one, according to Popovich. But he has an interior oriented 4 to complement him, and pick up the slack. The Mavs do not have an interior oriented 4 - so their need for the traditional 5 who mans the middle on both ends is even greater. Lafrentz cant do that. Walker cant do that. Dampier can.

You want to argue that LaFrentz is a 5 - but the NBA coaches all say otherwise. You may not accept the views of people here (even though there seem to be a ton of very smart basketball people here). But you need to believe that the NBA coaches know basketball insiude and out.

[Pirate]

You keep making the same arguments (he has the size) and asking the same question (why wouldnt he have worked here as a 5) so the answer remains the same and keeps being repeated when you keep repeating the question (because he is a 4, not a 5, and the Mavs need a 5 to complement Dirk).

You seem to think that a 5 is defined by size, but it is not. And where did anyone say that Walker was feasible as a 5? He was also a 4, playing the 5 badly.

You keep saying LaFrentz CAN do the job, merely because he is tall and can block shots. Dirk is taller, and he also can block shots. But he is not a 5 either (regardless of how Coach Nelson tries to use him sometimes).

Nesterovic is a center. A mediocre one, according to Popovich. But he has an interior oriented 4 to complement him, and pick up the slack. The Mavs do not have an interior oriented 4 - so their need for the traditional 5 who mans the middle on both ends is even greater. Lafrentz cant do that. Walker cant do that. Dampier can.

You want to argue that LaFrentz is a 5 - but the NBA coaches all say otherwise. You may not accept the views of people here (even though there seem to be a ton of very smart basketball people here). But you need to believe that the NBA coaches know basketball insiude and out.

[dude1394]

You keep saying the same thing although you don't seem to realize it. Raef isn't a '5", therefore he can't play the 5.

If Nesterovic is a center....why is he? Only because he can't play the 4?

You keep seeming to think I am ragging on dampier, I am not. He's a "different" center. Stronger, slower, less mobile but holds his ground well.

My argument is with the whole concept that a "center" has to be some sort of rock or slug in the middle. I don't think that dirk needs a dampier perse, we'll find out, a nesterovic would be fine as well. He just needs someone to take the fouls when cutters come down the lane and contest shots.

Just because LaFrenz is being used as a power forward because he has the skills and blount does not means nothing to me. If we want to argue that Raef is a BETTER power forward than CENTER I will agree with that, but that's not my point. My point is that with dirk, raef (and now josh) on the front line that is fine with me and gives me a faster more agile front line to boot.

And if we want to argue that Raef isn't the "perfect" center then I will agree with that as well, but for the mavs, I think he would be and was fine.

[dude1394]

You keep saying the same thing although you don't seem to realize it. Raef isn't a '5", therefore he can't play the 5.

If Nesterovic is a center....why is he? Only because he can't play the 4?

You keep seeming to think I am ragging on dampier, I am not. He's a "different" center. Stronger, slower, less mobile but holds his ground well.

My argument is with the whole concept that a "center" has to be some sort of rock or slug in the middle. I don't think that dirk needs a dampier perse, we'll find out, a nesterovic would be fine as well. He just needs someone to take the fouls when cutters come down the lane and contest shots.

Just because LaFrenz is being used as a power forward because he has the skills and blount does not means nothing to me. If we want to argue that Raef is a BETTER power forward than CENTER I will agree with that, but that's not my point. My point is that with dirk, raef (and now josh) on the front line that is fine with me and gives me a faster more agile front line to boot.

And if we want to argue that Raef isn't the "perfect" center then I will agree with that as well, but for the mavs, I think he would be and was fine.

[Pirate]

There is no sense debating with you, because you arent looking for anything objective.

"My point is that with dirk, raef (and now josh) on the front line that is fine with me ..." If you own a team some day, and dont care whether they get their brains stomped in or not, assemble it as you wish.

But Raef is not going to be your answer at center. He is tall. That is all you will get from him. He lacks the attitude (the want to) and the aptitude (the ability) to get the job done as an NBA center. NBA teams and coaches have tried and failed to make him a center. Your solution is to say "well, it doesnt matter if he is any good at the position, I would play him there anyhow." That is a mediocre solution. And to claim he is more than "unacceptable" at center is to say you are somehow more insightful than the entire NBA, all of whom are desperate for centers - and sorry but I dont believe that for a second.

"Fine with me" doesnt win championships. It takes a team that can play defense as well as offense, and get stops. Forfeiting the middle wont cut it.

[Pirate]

There is no sense debating with you, because you arent looking for anything objective.

"My point is that with dirk, raef (and now josh) on the front line that is fine with me ..." If you own a team some day, and dont care whether they get their brains stomped in or not, assemble it as you wish.

But Raef is not going to be your answer at center. He is tall. That is all you will get from him. He lacks the attitude (the want to) and the aptitude (the ability) to get the job done as an NBA center. NBA teams and coaches have tried and failed to make him a center. Your solution is to say "well, it doesnt matter if he is any good at the position, I would play him there anyhow." That is a mediocre solution. And to claim he is more than "unacceptable" at center is to say you are somehow more insightful than the entire NBA, all of whom are desperate for centers - and sorry but I dont believe that for a second.

"Fine with me" doesnt win championships. It takes a team that can play defense as well as offense, and get stops. Forfeiting the middle wont cut it.

[dude1394]

Yea, I'm sure that you've won many "championships". There is one data point that can be pointed to and that was that the mavs went to the WCF WITH the non-existent center raef. They had their best year in history, swept minnesota, took down the kings and pushed san antonion to their limit.

All without a center. Hmmm...I guess whoever they had as "center" was getting it done.

[dude1394]

Yea, I'm sure that you've won many "championships". There is one data point that can be pointed to and that was that the mavs went to the WCF WITH the non-existent center raef. They had their best year in history, swept minnesota, took down the kings and pushed san antonion to their limit.

All without a center. Hmmm...I guess whoever they had as "center" was getting it done.

[vinnieponte]

OMG how long do we have to speak about raef?? He isn't as good as damp and we dont want him, the end.

[vinnieponte]

OMG how long do we have to speak about raef?? He isn't as good as damp and we dont want him, the end.

[madape]

Originally posted by: vinnieponte
OMG how long do we have to speak about raef?? He isn't as good as damp and we dont want him, the end.

Not as good as Damp? Using what metric? He's putting up better rebounding numbers. He's on a different plane in terms of shotblocking. He has a more complete offensive game. He's had success in the playoffs. He's younger. His contract is shorter. Dump has been an enormous disappontment for the Mavs. The coaching staff has already started routinely ripping him in the paper. On the other hands, I think Boston is more than pleased with LaFrentz. I think they regard him as one of the brightest spots on their team. He could very well could be the second most valuable Celtic behind Pierce. If Dampier was coming anywhere close to Raef's numbers, everyone on this board would be calling for an all-star selection. But the last time anyone on this board talked about Dampier in the all-star game was the first time Dampier stepped on the court. Why? Because Dump hasn't done a damn thing here. In fact, he's sucked.

This organization fucked up big time when they traded Raef for Antoine Walker. And they fucked up again when they traded for Dampier. I know this is quickly becoming a Maverick cheerleader site, but I'd prefer to talk about the things this team has done poorly over the past few years as well as the things they've done well. The Dampier trade, the Antoine Walker trade, and the Nash decision are in my decision the top three worst decisions this franshise has made in the past 20 years. I don't know what order I'd put them in right now, but the way Raef is playing this year, it's looking more and more like the Raef/Walker trade could be #1. That's worth talking about.

[madape]

Originally posted by: vinnieponte
OMG how long do we have to speak about raef?? He isn't as good as damp and we dont want him, the end.

Not as good as Damp? Using what metric? He's putting up better rebounding numbers. He's on a different plane in terms of shotblocking. He has a more complete offensive game. He's had success in the playoffs. He's younger. His contract is shorter. Dump has been an enormous disappontment for the Mavs. The coaching staff has already started routinely ripping him in the paper. On the other hands, I think Boston is more than pleased with LaFrentz. I think they regard him as one of the brightest spots on their team. He could very well could be the second most valuable Celtic behind Pierce. If Dampier was coming anywhere close to Raef's numbers, everyone on this board would be calling for an all-star selection. But the last time anyone on this board talked about Dampier in the all-star game was the first time Dampier stepped on the court. Why? Because Dump hasn't done a damn thing here. In fact, he's sucked.

This organization fucked up big time when they traded Raef for Antoine Walker. And they fucked up again when they traded for Dampier. I know this is quickly becoming a Maverick cheerleader site, but I'd prefer to talk about the things this team has done poorly over the past few years as well as the things they've done well. The Dampier trade, the Antoine Walker trade, and the Nash decision are in my decision the top three worst decisions this franshise has made in the past 20 years. I don't know what order I'd put them in right now, but the way Raef is playing this year, it's looking more and more like the Raef/Walker trade could be #1. That's worth talking about.

[kg_veteran]

ape - I'm beginning to think that your Raef fixation must be schtick. How else could you explain being so detached from reality?

Raef LaFrentz is posting pretty decent individual numbers on a BAD team. Good for him. Dampier posted really good individual numbers last year on a BAD team. It didn't prove anything, either. Heck, P.J. Brown and Mehmet Okur are posting stats that are fairly similar to Raef's stats, and nobody has anointed them as good centers. They're just guys racking up decent stats on bad teams.

Raef is such a great center that his Celtics get crushed on the glass to the tune of a -2.6 rpg differential, they give up .446 opposing FG%, they give up 100.9 ppg (29th in the league), and they are 13-17. An Eastern Conference team with a very solid veteran PG, All-Star swingman, and two other decent starters (Davis and Blount) ought to be a playoff squad. But they aren't. If the playoffs started today, your boy Raef would be left sitting at home.

Raef didn't cut it here before, and he wouldn't if he were still here now. That's reality.

[kg_veteran]

ape - I'm beginning to think that your Raef fixation must be schtick. How else could you explain being so detached from reality?

Raef LaFrentz is posting pretty decent individual numbers on a BAD team. Good for him. Dampier posted really good individual numbers last year on a BAD team. It didn't prove anything, either. Heck, P.J. Brown and Mehmet Okur are posting stats that are fairly similar to Raef's stats, and nobody has anointed them as good centers. They're just guys racking up decent stats on bad teams.

Raef is such a great center that his Celtics get crushed on the glass to the tune of a -2.6 rpg differential, they give up .446 opposing FG%, they give up 100.9 ppg (29th in the league), and they are 13-17. An Eastern Conference team with a very solid veteran PG, All-Star swingman, and two other decent starters (Davis and Blount) ought to be a playoff squad. But they aren't. If the playoffs started today, your boy Raef would be left sitting at home.

Raef didn't cut it here before, and he wouldn't if he were still here now. That's reality.

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: vinnieponte
OMG how long do we have to speak about raef?? He isn't as good as damp and we dont want him, the end.

Change the channel if you don't like the programming.

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: vinnieponte
OMG how long do we have to speak about raef?? He isn't as good as damp and we dont want him, the end.

Change the channel if you don't like the programming.

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: kg_veteran
ape - I'm beginning to think that your Raef fixation must be schtick. How else could you explain being so detached from reality?

Raef LaFrentz is posting pretty decent individual numbers on a BAD team. Good for him. Dampier posted really good individual numbers last year on a BAD team. It didn't prove anything, either. Heck, P.J. Brown and Mehmet Okur are posting stats that are fairly similar to Raef's stats, and nobody has anointed them as good centers. They're just guys racking up decent stats on bad teams.

Raef is such a great center that his Celtics get crushed on the glass to the tune of a -2.6 rpg differential, they give up .446 opposing FG%, they give up 100.9 ppg (29th in the league), and they are 13-17. An Eastern Conference team with a very solid veteran PG, All-Star swingman, and two other decent starters (Davis and Blount) ought to be a playoff squad. But they aren't. If the playoffs started today, your boy Raef would be left sitting at home.

Raef didn't cut it here before, and he wouldn't if he were still here now. That's reality.

But before injury raef was posting those same numbers on the MAVS team.

Also raef (as I have been brow-beaten to death about ) is NOT playing center he's playing forward. He also does NOT have a dirk pulling down 10+ beside him and moreso this year a josh howard who is pulling down almost another 10.

Again I'm not hard over against Damp as 'ape is, but I also would just as soon have raef on this team in the middle... Call me crazy (folks here have), call me a moron (folks here have), call me an idiot(many folks here have) but if we keep saying that statistics don't lie, then why do raefs 2001 stats not count, nor his current ones. Seems selective to me.

[dude1394]

Originally posted by: kg_veteran
ape - I'm beginning to think that your Raef fixation must be schtick. How else could you explain being so detached from reality?

Raef LaFrentz is posting pretty decent individual numbers on a BAD team. Good for him. Dampier posted really good individual numbers last year on a BAD team. It didn't prove anything, either. Heck, P.J. Brown and Mehmet Okur are posting stats that are fairly similar to Raef's stats, and nobody has anointed them as good centers. They're just guys racking up decent stats on bad teams.

Raef is such a great center that his Celtics get crushed on the glass to the tune of a -2.6 rpg differential, they give up .446 opposing FG%, they give up 100.9 ppg (29th in the league), and they are 13-17. An Eastern Conference team with a very solid veteran PG, All-Star swingman, and two other decent starters (Davis and Blount) ought to be a playoff squad. But they aren't. If the playoffs started today, your boy Raef would be left sitting at home.

Raef didn't cut it here before, and he wouldn't if he were still here now. That's reality.

But before injury raef was posting those same numbers on the MAVS team.

Also raef (as I have been brow-beaten to death about ) is NOT playing center he's playing forward. He also does NOT have a dirk pulling down 10+ beside him and moreso this year a josh howard who is pulling down almost another 10.

Again I'm not hard over against Damp as 'ape is, but I also would just as soon have raef on this team in the middle... Call me crazy (folks here have), call me a moron (folks here have), call me an idiot(many folks here have) but if we keep saying that statistics don't lie, then why do raefs 2001 stats not count, nor his current ones. Seems selective to me.

[kg_veteran]

Originally posted by: dude1394

But before injury raef was posting those same numbers on the MAVS team.

Also raef (as I have been brow-beaten to death about ) is NOT playing center he's playing forward. He also does NOT have a dirk pulling down 10+ beside him and moreso this year a josh howard who is pulling down almost another 10.

Again I'm not hard over against Damp as 'ape is, but I also would just as soon have raef on this team in the middle... Call me crazy (folks here have), call me a moron (folks here have), call me an idiot(many folks here have) but if we keep saying that statistics don't lie, then why do raefs 2001 stats not count, nor his current ones. Seems selective to me.

I'm not calling you any names. Raef posted pretty decent stats in Dallas in 01-02. But the Mavs got killed in the middle in the playoffs, and they weren't good defensively. At all. The reason they were pretty decent defensively in 02-03 is that the Mavs actually used Shawn Bradley, and frankly they caught a lot of opponents by surprise with their zone early on.

Statistics count, but they tell us that Raef has never really been the anchor of a good defense in his entire career.

[kg_veteran]

Originally posted by: dude1394

But before injury raef was posting those same numbers on the MAVS team.

Also raef (as I have been brow-beaten to death about ) is NOT playing center he's playing forward. He also does NOT have a dirk pulling down 10+ beside him and moreso this year a josh howard who is pulling down almost another 10.

Again I'm not hard over against Damp as 'ape is, but I also would just as soon have raef on this team in the middle... Call me crazy (folks here have), call me a moron (folks here have), call me an idiot(many folks here have) but if we keep saying that statistics don't lie, then why do raefs 2001 stats not count, nor his current ones. Seems selective to me.

I'm not calling you any names. Raef posted pretty decent stats in Dallas in 01-02. But the Mavs got killed in the middle in the playoffs, and they weren't good defensively. At all. The reason they were pretty decent defensively in 02-03 is that the Mavs actually used Shawn Bradley, and frankly they caught a lot of opponents by surprise with their zone early on.

Statistics count, but they tell us that Raef has never really been the anchor of a good defense in his entire career.

[dude1394]

I know you weren't calling me names, you haven't nor do you, it's appreciated, it wasn't directed towards you, but the nattering nabobs of negativities and should have not been in a respose. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

I don't disagree with you but also would have to wonder if that wasn't a matter of focus as much as anything (fyi, I think it was). There was never a banner up there before, nor did nellie seem all that interested in any defense. Even last year, he wouldn't play any center except GAG walker.

I've had a difficult time blaming raef/dirk/bradley and dampier (I've read the posts about getting cheap fouls) when we had stevie/nve/finley on the perimeter. Raef was lucky to stay on the court with that ole' lineup.

Put the same guy in with jason terry, finley, josh, dirk, I think they would be pretty good defensively, maybe not the greatest but pretty good.

The only thing that is starting to make me re-think my position is if raef WERE used more in the low-post, we'd have murphy going ballistic about dirk not getting enough shots. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[dude1394]

I know you weren't calling me names, you haven't nor do you, it's appreciated, it wasn't directed towards you, but the nattering nabobs of negativities and should have not been in a respose. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

I don't disagree with you but also would have to wonder if that wasn't a matter of focus as much as anything (fyi, I think it was). There was never a banner up there before, nor did nellie seem all that interested in any defense. Even last year, he wouldn't play any center except GAG walker.

I've had a difficult time blaming raef/dirk/bradley and dampier (I've read the posts about getting cheap fouls) when we had stevie/nve/finley on the perimeter. Raef was lucky to stay on the court with that ole' lineup.

Put the same guy in with jason terry, finley, josh, dirk, I think they would be pretty good defensively, maybe not the greatest but pretty good.

The only thing that is starting to make me re-think my position is if raef WERE used more in the low-post, we'd have murphy going ballistic about dirk not getting enough shots. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[kg_veteran]

Originally posted by: dude1394
The only thing that is starting to make me re-think my position is if raef WERE used more in the low-post, we'd have murphy going ballistic about dirk not getting enough shots. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Good point. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[kg_veteran]

Originally posted by: dude1394
The only thing that is starting to make me re-think my position is if raef WERE used more in the low-post, we'd have murphy going ballistic about dirk not getting enough shots. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Good point. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]